Oddly silent

20/20 sanctimonious hindsight, or sobering reality?

www.mcclatchydc.com/2014/12/13/249968_ye...-detention.html?rh=1

Documented on other sites, as well.

The more I research, the more pissed off I get: www.factcheck.org/2014/12/cheneys-tortured-facts/

One sided? Non-partisan? Democratic political maneuver? Hardly....

Cheney also told only part of the story on “Meet the Press” when he said the Intelligence Committee’s investigators failed to interview key CIA officials, a point raised often by other critics of the report.

Cheney, Dec. 14: "The report is seriously flawed. They didn’t talk to anybody who knew anything about the program. They didn’t talk to anybody within the program."

That’s true as far as it goes. What Cheney failed to mention, however, is that the committee investigators were deferring to Justice Department investigators who were pursuing possible criminal charges, and that the Senate staff had access to transcripts of dozens of interviews with CIA officials conducted by the agency’s own inspector general and others.

For what it's worth, here is a recent poll from after the report was released...

In the poll, 51 percent say the interrogation practices used during the Bush Era were acceptable, while 28 percent say they went too far and were wrong.

In addition, 45 percent think they should be used in the future, versus 28 percent who disagree.

www.nbcnews.com/storyline/cia-torture-re...e-acceptable-n269211

And also for what it's worth, I do consider water boarding to be a form of torture. But I'm not losing any sleep over the fact that three of the worst scumbags ever got water boarded in this country, not that I'd of supported it.

I have more a problem with rendition where we send them to other countries and most anything might happen. Even under our own "control", our policies at the time have influenced disgraceful actions. See Abu Ghraib...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib_torture_and_prisoner_abuse

ZHawke wrote:

Rick wrote: Well, "we" as a country don't consider unborn life to be human, so I don't see anything wrong with exempting these barbarians from the human race.

Not so sure that's a relevant comparison. Would that not also make "we"/"us" barbarians, as well?

Yes, imo it does. "We" have killed so many unborn humans that "we" have become indifferent to it. Just because "we've" been doing this killing for so long, that doesn't mean the killing is more moral than pouring water on the face of a murdering terrorist in order to scare the holy crap out of him.

Rick wrote:

ZHawke wrote:

Rick wrote: Well, "we" as a country don't consider unborn life to be human, so I don't see anything wrong with exempting these barbarians from the human race.

Not so sure that's a relevant comparison. Would that not also make "we"/"us" barbarians, as well?

Yes, imo it does. "We" have killed so many unborn humans that "we" have become indifferent to it. Just because "we've" been doing this killing for so long, that doesn't mean the killing is more moral than pouring water on the face of a murdering terrorist in order to scare the holy crap out of him.

So, you condone torture?

A group of us were discussing the "torture" and it came down to this. Say all you want about whether or not you condone the type of "torture" used, make it personal.

If your wife/husband/child/parents/friend were being held by someone, and would likely be raped/tortured/killed if you didn't find them, and you had the opportunity to "torture" an accomplice of the one holding your loved one to find them and save them....would you condone it.

To answer RenCJ, without hesitation and to what ever extent it took.

RenegadeCJ wrote: A group of us were discussing the "torture" and it came down to this. Say all you want about whether or not you condone the type of "torture" used, make it personal.

If your wife/husband/child/parents/friend were being held by someone, and would likely be raped/tortured/killed if you didn't find them, and you had the opportunity to "torture" an accomplice of the one holding your loved one to find them and save them....would you condone it.

Not the same thing at all. I don't believe the two have anything whatsoever to do with each other.

You and I both know we would do anything we could on a personal level to safeguard and protect members of our family and loved ones. That's a totally different thing from sanctioning and engaging in government sponsored torture.

It seems odd to me so many are willing to go to that extreme and support government actions of torture while so strenuously "criminalizing" government actions in so many other areas.

ZHawke wrote:

RenegadeCJ wrote: A group of us were discussing the "torture" and it came down to this. Say all you want about whether or not you condone the type of "torture" used, make it personal.

If your wife/husband/child/parents/friend were being held by someone, and would likely be raped/tortured/killed if you didn't find them, and you had the opportunity to "torture" an accomplice of the one holding your loved one to find them and save them....would you condone it.

Not the same thing at all. I don't believe the two have anything whatsoever to do with each other.

You and I both know we would do anything we could on a personal level to safeguard and protect members of our family and loved ones. That's a totally different thing from sanctioning and engaging in government sponsored torture.

It seems odd to me so many are willing to go to that extreme and support government actions of torture while so strenuously "criminalizing" government actions in so many other areas.

It is the same to me. You either condone it, or you don't. Is torture ok or not.