media can't accept the scientific evidence on BPA

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

major bean wrote: Science is not just bent to the influences of the political, money moguls, etc.
There are those who believe that science is pure of heart.
I do believe that the illustrations that I have posted show that science is rotten from within.

I'm trying to understand where you come from, but am having a hard time with it. The only thing I can think of is that scientific thought evolves and because ideas and interpretations on certain subjects change it is an indication of science being bent and rotten? Am I even close? What voluminous data have you posted that corroborates such sweeping generalizations? If you want to forward a few examples where scientist have become the Darth Vadors, it does not condemn all of science as you would have us believe. In fact I take personal offense to that as you insinuate I lack integrity, something that is exceptionally dear to my heart when it comes to science and personal dealings.

I'll tell you exactly where I am coming from:
Science makes many false starts in directions that later have to me rescinded. But in the meantime, science's conclusions are taken as gospel. Science is filled with people of ego and reputation who will not surrender their places of imminence with grace but defend their research with every unscrupulous tactic that they can devise. Every college of science in every university is headed by such imminent people.

I understand that scientists will defend science. That is the nature of the beast. I realize that it galls them that those who observe science are allowed evaluate and judge the whole field of science, but that is the way that the world works. Ultimately, historians judge science and school children read from historians about the trials, failings, triumphs, and frauds of science.
Science, as revealed by history, is not the pure, undefiled, holy discipline that scientists would have you believe.

Major Bean, excellent posts ....debunking the frauds in science is a much need industry....all of sudden we would have 90% less "scientist" and left with real scientist.

Just don't get him started on child birth and drugs...

major bean wrote:

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

major bean wrote: Science is not just bent to the influences of the political, money moguls, etc.
There are those who believe that science is pure of heart.
I do believe that the illustrations that I have posted show that science is rotten from within.

I'm trying to understand where you come from, but am having a hard time with it. The only thing I can think of is that scientific thought evolves and because ideas and interpretations on certain subjects change it is an indication of science being bent and rotten? Am I even close? What voluminous data have you posted that corroborates such sweeping generalizations? If you want to forward a few examples where scientist have become the Darth Vadors, it does not condemn all of science as you would have us believe. In fact I take personal offense to that as you insinuate I lack integrity, something that is exceptionally dear to my heart when it comes to science and personal dealings.

I'll tell you exactly where I am coming from:
Science makes many false starts in directions that later have to me rescinded. But in the meantime, science's conclusions are taken as gospel. Science is filled with people of ego and reputation who will not surrender their places of imminence with grace but defend their research with every unscrupulous tactic that they can devise. Every college of science in every university is headed by such imminent people.

I understand that scientists will defend science. That is the nature of the beast. I realize that it galls them that those who observe science are allowed evaluate and judge the whole field of science, but that is the way that the world works. Ultimately, historians judge science and school children read from historians about the trials, failings, triumphs, and frauds of science.
Science, as revealed by history, is not the pure, undefiled, holy discipline that scientists would have you believe.

I think it is the generalization that stinks. There are many points with which I concur. Science is full of theories that are developed on sparse data that is not well understood. The fact others take is as gospel is not the fault of the scientist, but the people who elect to believe in it without questioning.
There are many big egos at universities. Indeed many wrongly believe they are infallible and get married to their interpretations. It is not just these people, but more ordinary "scientist" who do the same thing. Personal experience shows this is because they have few original ideas and once they get one feel a need to defend it even in light of data completely opposing their conclusions. Science ought to be a search for truth, regardless of where it takes you. If you formulate a working hypothesis that seems to incorporate all available data comfortably at the time, but subsequently discover new data that invalidates or mitigates your findings, the true scientist will accept that, revise their hypothesis or even throw it out entirely and come up with a new one. As I like to say "It's just and interpretation" I'd like my reputation to be that I pursue the truth by doing sound work. That is all I need as a reward, well, lets be practical, I also need to get paid.

During my pursuit of paleontology, the Lügenstein" is one of the first things we learn about. It is a scientific fraud perpetuated by a professor who wanted desperately to make original and unique contributions. So he invented them. Also a fellow graduate student got caught manufacturing data to fit the curve. These are not scientists, they are indeed frauds that a scientific community seeks to expose for who they are. No discipline is pure. Science is not pure as a whole, but there are many in the sciences who are no motivated by greed, fame or fortune, but by the thrill of discovery. This is what drives and thrills me and I imagine more scientist than frauds. Many of us are not equivalent to the King James of basketball, but are ordinary professionals who seek to do the best work we can.

Photo-fish wrote:

i like that.

And now let's get back to the thread. It has to do not with science frauds, but media frauds.