Why Fighting Energy-Efficient Light Bulbs Is So Stupid

Thanks for the response. It seems we agree on the problems, just not on the solutions.

AspenValley wrote:

neptunechimney wrote:

AspenValley wrote:

neptunechimney wrote: As the piece says, it is called crony capitalism. It is much loved by both r's and d's. It is an inevitable by product of a government that has the power to legislate economic success and failure.

The sane liberals have to wake up to the fact the the same kind of people who are evil heartless capitalists are elected to political office.

I think what you need to wake up to is that is PRECISELY what some of us have been saying for thirty years. And much more loudly in the past four or five.

I was not aware of that. Can you illuminate what solutions those of you who are aware of it have been advocating?

At this point, the most I can hope for is that people even become AWARE of it. The most important solution in my mind would be to fight back against the large increase in rights and influence the courts are granting to corporations. Second would be to put much more strict rules on corporate lobbying. Also new regulations that would help stop the trend of placing more and more corporate insiders in regulatory positions (foxes in the henhouse) in every executive department from science to environmental to financial oversight. Election reform to prevent corporations from making backdoor contributions and setting up phony PACs that hide who is really behind them. The way things are going, pretty soon the government will be little more than of the Corporation, for the Corporation, by the Corporation.

And lastly, make people aware that every politician of every political stripe out there has probably been bought and paid for by a basket of corporate interests and to stop believing that just because they talk about wanting to implement your pet cause, they simply will not do so unless it somehow benefits their corporate masters, or at least doesn't harm their causes. Politics in 2011 isn't about core values the way most people seem to think, it's about MONEY. If you want to fight a culture war, fight it on a different front because otherwise you will be disappointed time after time when "your guy or gal" suddenly seems a lot less interested in your values issues than they did before the election.

neptunechimney wrote: Thanks for the response. It seems we agree on the problems, just not on the solutions.

So what do your solutions look like?

AspenValley wrote:

neptunechimney wrote: Thanks for the response. It seems we agree on the problems, just not on the solutions.

So what do your solutions look like?

Simple. Reduce the power of government to legislate economic success and failure.

Referring to your post, what gives the courts the power to grant rights and influence to corporations? I say it is a government that has too much power.

Strict rules of lobbying is a fine idea but as you say it is asking the foxes to regulate themselves. If you reduce the power of gov. to regulate, you reduce the value of lobbying.

neptunechimney wrote:

AspenValley wrote:

neptunechimney wrote: Thanks for the response. It seems we agree on the problems, just not on the solutions.

So what do your solutions look like?

Simple. Reduce the power of government to legislate economic success and failure.

Referring to your post, what gives the courts the power to grant rights and influence to corporations? I say it is a government that has too much power.

Strict rules of lobbying is a fine idea but as you say it is asking the foxes to regulate themselves. If you reduce the power of gov. to regulate, you reduce the value of lobbying.

"Reduce the power of government to legislate economic success and failure".

Okay, can't argue with that per se, but how do you suggest it be accomplished since the government is now effectively controlled by corporations who would stop at nothing to prevent that?

And the courts are now controlled by the hand-picked minions of those corporations, who can be counted on to rule over and over in favor of their interests. Even if you took away all of Congress' funding and power short of impeaching the whole Supreme Court, how do you stop that?

Again, can't disagree with the problems with lobbyists and Congress,it would be very difficult if not impossible to force Congress to pass laws that would prevent the bennies they enjoy by allowing practically unlimited lobbying and corporate donations.

AspenValley wrote:

neptunechimney wrote:

AspenValley wrote:

neptunechimney wrote: Thanks for the response. It seems we agree on the problems, just not on the solutions.

So what do your solutions look like?

Simple. Reduce the power of government to legislate economic success and failure.

Referring to your post, what gives the courts the power to grant rights and influence to corporations? I say it is a government that has too much power.

Strict rules of lobbying is a fine idea but as you say it is asking the foxes to regulate themselves. If you reduce the power of gov. to regulate, you reduce the value of lobbying.

"Reduce the power of government to legislate economic success and failure".

Okay, can't argue with that per se, but how do you suggest it be accomplished since the government is now effectively controlled by corporations who would stop at nothing to prevent that?

And the courts are now controlled by the hand-picked minions of those corporations, who can be counted on to rule over and over in favor of their interests. Even if you took away all of Congress' funding and power short of impeaching the whole Supreme Court, how do you stop that?

Again, can't disagree with the problems with lobbyists and Congress,it would be very difficult if not impossible to force Congress to pass laws that would prevent the bennies they enjoy by allowing practically unlimited lobbying and corporate donations.

Elections still matter. We need to elect more pol's who are not lap dogs and hold there feet to the fire. In the end they will do what they deem necessary to be reelected.

Umm, light bulbs?

Yes... We must elect pols who will FIGHT against saving energy, and stand up for the conservative right to be stupid.

LadyJazzer wrote: Yes... We must elect pols who will FIGHT against saving energy, and stand up for the conservative right to be stupid.

You forgot evil, ignorant and racist.

It's early....

I just hope those who think CFL's are really dangerous and can cause cancer have converted back to using those big TV-type monitors with their computer to show their commitment.

Afterall, most LCD displays on laptops and desktop monitors use CFL's for backlighting and you have them right in your face. :VeryScared: