Why I am not a Libertarian.

Why I Am Not a Libertarian

Of all the political movements out there, the Libertarians have the coolest rhetoric. No matter what the issue is, they get to talk about Freedom vs. Tyranny and quote all that rousing stuff the Founders said about King George.

It’s also the perfect belief system for a young male (and maybe, by now, young females too). You don’t need knowledge or experience of any specific situations, you just need to understand the One Big Idea That Solves Everything: Other than a small and appropriately humbled military and judicial establishment, government is bad. Protect life, protect property, enforce contracts — and leave everything else to the market.

http://weeklysift.com/2011/08/22/why-i- ... bertarian/

This guys arguments fall apart as soon as you apply simple logic to each of his complaints. We do not know how much better off the entire society would be had we stuck to the libertarian principles that the founding fathers aspired to- because we abandoned their principles around 1900.

We do know that the most powerful country ever to exist, the country with the greatest measure of freedom and liberty, the best economic opportunity available to the largest share of it's citizens- was created with libertarian philosophy- and it thrived and expanded until we started to allow government to control every aspect of our lives.

This guy seems to have flip-flopped into and out of various beliefs throughout his life- so it's no wonder that he has eventually found himself most recently a socialist. Real solid moral people are not floozies- they know what they believe and why they believe it. I suppose his argument for government control will eventually lead to totalitarianism- like every other example government run amok. Is he happy with the current state of affairs?

I guess so.

For those of us who know what a mess this creates, libertarianism is a solid solution. The blogger supposes that there is no other solution to a "plague"- than to have government "in general behave like tyrants". This is such childish bullsh** it's not even funny- of course there are other ways to address this problem than by government control. And when a real plague hits us- we will all see how well government handles it- history tells us the government's record on such matters is pretty dismal!

Global warming- another argument brought up by this guy- and he thinks that government is the solution to this problem? To truely have a government solution for this- we would need a one world government, so I guess this is what he wants! That's flat out socialism. And how's the government's record on solving this problem so far- there are hundreds of governments in the world, and none of them agree on this issue, the only ones in agreement are countries that stand to win economically by looting countries like America.

Yes- and so this problem is being promoted by socialist governments all over the world- so they can be given their just compensation, instead of earning it.

And then there is the weakest of all his arguments- property. As if it takes a large government to protect property rights. In fact we lose our property rights more and more as government gets larger and larger. Many property owners can not do anything at all with their own property any more with all the regulations and restrictions that local governments have placed upon private property. The system worked much much better 150 years ago - before all these laws and restrictions and regulations and the TAXES that go along with these governments came into being.

Private property arose at the same time as the agricultural era, and predated the nation-state. This is historical fact. The basic idea is that a system which allows everyone to easily figure out which objects they are and are not allowed to touch creates minimal conflict so it’s in everyone’s enlightened self-interest to support it.

This guy was never a libertarian - I suspect he has been a socialist all his life. We must start to question wishy washy people like this- who say they once believed in one system- only to become "enlightened" by his obiviously lacking experience into somthing the exact opposite- especially when that exact opposite is socialism.

Who's he trying to fool- problem is sombody might buy into his bullsh** line!

I would submit that we'd be a whole lot better off if we would have stuck to libertarian principals - with one glaring exception (in my opinion) - and that is a totally free market. My take on that is that totally free markets produce the sweatshops, child labor, Pinkerton thugs, and all the other excesses of greedheads that marred the early industrial revolution. I think there has to be some regulation of the market to curb these problems.

Hence the term "Robber Barons" that precipitated the government finally stepping to stop the greedy from taking over.

cydl wrote: I would submit that we'd be a whole lot better off if we would have stuck to libertarian principals - with one glaring exception (in my opinion) - and that is a totally free market. My take on that is that totally free markets produce the sweatshops, child labor, Pinkerton thugs, and all the other excesses of greedheads that marred the early industrial revolution. I think there has to be some regulation of the market to curb these problems.

I agree 100%.

chickaree wrote:

cydl wrote: I would submit that we'd be a whole lot better off if we would have stuck to libertarian principals - with one glaring exception (in my opinion) - and that is a totally free market. My take on that is that totally free markets produce the sweatshops, child labor, Pinkerton thugs, and all the other excesses of greedheads that marred the early industrial revolution. I think there has to be some regulation of the market to curb these problems.

I agree 100%.

I also agree. I have always believed that if we had stuck to those principles, the entire country (and world) would be so much better off. We would not have massive debt problems, and government would have been much more limited- we would all have more liberty, freedom and opportunity today.

Government has not solved those "free market" problems that you mention though, we have just managed to export those problems. We still buy shoes and clothes made in sweat shops- by child labor today.

And Libertarian does not mean anarchy- there's a big difference. It means limited government, not no government. It means when there is a legitimate and real (not precieved) need for government- then we use government, always be on the lookout for a solution that does not require government, and where it's involvement can be excluded- we should do so. Libertarians believe in law and order- but in a much more limited manner than what we have today.

I believe my body and my labor belong to me first- not the government first, and a much smaller amount of it is all that is really required for government. The idea that out of 30 years of my work and sweat and labor, 10 years of it belongs to the government is far overreaching the original intent of government, and it makes slaves out of us all.

I'm still ready to help you pack....

I'm still ready to help you pack....

LJ- you might not want to hold your breath..... I grew up in this area, this is home.

Where are you from- New Jersey?

Tell the truth now LJ!

Originally? Texas... (But Texas has turned into "Bubba-Ville", so I don't admit to it.) But I left nearly 40 years ago, so I got out before whatever it is they put in the water that turns you conservative and stupid took hold.

BearMtnHIB wrote: Government has not solved those "free market" problems that you mention though, we have just managed to export those problems. We still buy shoes and clothes made in sweat shops- by child labor today.

Sadly, this is also true. And I'm not certain I know the answer - maybe there isn't one. Some of those "free market" problems were solved (at least here) by the rise of labor unions, although you rightly point out that they were simply exported. But they were ended here at a bloody price. And the unions have gone the way of the large, greedy, corrupt corporations, IMO.

Some argue that this country has never had truly free markets and so the concept of self-regulation by the marketplace has never been put to the test. I don't know that that's true. If it is, I suspect it was 'way back when the marketplace was dominated by small, family-owned businesses, not multi-national corporations. Big difference there in power and influence.