Biggest income drop in 20 years

Are you on this list?



Then you are not who I'm talking about... But feel free to continue your "I'm so mistreated" meme....

I gave you at least a half dozen specifics...If you'd actually read what I wrote. Here they are again:


Three BIG loopholes to close:

No More Amsterdam Sandwiches

Obama has called repeatedly for corporate reform that would stop multinationals from shipping profits overseas in order to avoid paying U.S. taxes. The policy paper, for example, proposed a minimum tax on offshore earnings to encourage domestic investment and "prevent a race to the bottom in corporate tax rates."

These aims hew closely to legislation recently introduced by Sen. Carl Levin, (D-Mich.) and Kent Conrad (D-N.D.) that would attempt to stop U.S. companies from shipping patents and other assets to offshore affiliates. One infamous technique, pioneered by Apple, is known as the "Double Irish With a Dutch Sandwich." The maneuver is complicated, but essentially it allows U.S. companies to move profits through Ireland, the Netherlands and then on to a tax haven in the Caribbean in order to lower the U.S. tax bill. Over the last three years, Apple, Google and Microsoft have used techniques like this to avoid paying taxes on $80 billion in profits over a three year period, a recent Senate subcommittee on investigations found.


Ending The "Facebook" Break

The U.S. tax code permits companies to deduct the cost stock options as an expense that reduces profits, just like cash compensation. According to Citizens for Tax Justice, in a report picked up by Bloomberg News, the stock options cashed in after the Facebook IPO will allow the company to claim a tax refund of $429 million.

So what's the problem? The tax code permits companies like Facebook to take stock option deductions in excess of expenses. So, for example, Facebook booked stock options given to founder Mark Zuckerberg at 6 cents per share, according to Levin. The company later claimed a deduction at about $40 per share. Moreover, Facebook can carry forward deductions -- and indeed, has an additional $2.17 billion that it can apply against future tax bills, Citizens for Tax Justice calculates.

This "excess" deduction, according to Levin's calculations, has cost the Treasury between $12 billion and $61 billion a year in lost revenue.


Carried Interest / "Make Mitt Pay More"

As you no doubt have heard by now, former Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney probably pays a lower effective tax rate than you. That's because of the "carried interest" rule, which allows private equity managers to to treat the fees they charge to manage a client's portfolio -- typically, a one-fifth share of any profits -- as investment income, subject to a lower 20 percent capital gains tax rate than the top 39.6 percent marginal rate.

Obama specifically mentioned the carried interest break on the campaign trail, and again in the run-up to the last fiscal cliff crisis, in December. Eliminating the perk, though, won't do much to ease the budget deficit. It costs Treasury about $1.3 billion a year.

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So, in MY world, the House and Senate GROW A PAIR and close the corporate loopholes that allow those smart lawyers to move assets around, dodge taxes, and take advantage of regulators who always seem to come from the very institutions they're supposed to be regulating. I'm not interested in the usual drivel from the Randroids about "taking corporate profits" (presumably to 'redistribute'...or, as the neanderthal puts it, "hand some of those profits over to those less fortunate") I'm interested in closing the loopholes that give these vultures a free ride. Apple, Microsoft, G.E., ad nauseum...

I want to see the tax-breaks for corporate jets gone; I want to see tax-breaks for corporate yachts gone; I want to see limits on mortgage deductions for 2nd, 3rd, .... 7th, 8th homes GONE for people who make more than $1million... I want to see $4-BILLION/year subsidies for oil/gas companies gone.... There's a much longer list, but that will do for now...

There...Does that help? Perhaps if the corporations that are dodging their taxes, paying NO taxes, and moving their money around to KEEP from paying taxes actually paid what they should be paying, then small-business owners such as yourself, wouldn't feel the pain so much.

Nah... They're rich...Let 'em keep it... Huh?

Yikes I actually am on that list, but so are you.

I own shares of some of those firms. I do a lot of business with Verizon. I have flown on Boeing planes. I make payments to vendors into their Wells Fargo accounts, I drink Pepsi products (and eat their other food), I use Dupont products constantly, I have Honeywell equipment, corning cookware.....gee I am an American, so I likely own shares or do business with all of those firms, as do many reading this directly or indirectly. Our govt likely does business with all of these folks, so raising their taxes will raise our taxes as we have to buy from them to run our country the way it is currently designed.

If we close loopholes for them, they are going to either raise the cost of the good I buy, lower my stock price or lower the wages of their employees.

I accept that you did suggest some things we could do. Now why not suggest some things that will solve the issue you brought up. You feel the govt needs more money. If you get your way, the CEO will still get what he gets, and we will pay more or be paid less to again....

...make you feel good, but change little to nothing, in fact, concentrate power even more. Do you really think if they did the things you suggest, that poor people would make more money and be employed in greater numbers in any measurable way? And could you do it without a gun?

Why not make a simple law so that we don't have big corporations anymore, if you don't want them around, why beat around the bush? Just limit a company to 100 people or something, if you are going to use force, at least force some real change, not some subtle thing that guys like me will just use to take advantage of people like you and those you worry about more.

Good... They need to pay their taxes... If we pay a little more, so be it...

Solve the issue I brought up?...I didn't bring it up...I posted a couple of charts that proved the lie that the top 1% have been making out like bandits for 20 years, while the 99% have been getting shafted for 30years.

Why not just make the corporation pay the taxes they owe?...So much simpler.

LadyJazzer wrote:

FredHayek wrote: US corporations not paying taxes? Sounds like Obama needs to fix that. Blame Congress? Then why did corporations pay no taxes when Pelosi was in charge too?

Seeing as how the loopholes that are allowing this kind of tax-avoidance were passed during the Bush administration...

But you feel free to insert your "They did it too" bullsh*t here: ______________________________________

but Pelosi and Obama had opportunities to close the loopholes and they didn't.

In my world, it's not about "handing over some of their profits", it's about the corporations pay their taxes, instead of hiding it offshore and moving it around

So......corporations pay more taxes for what?

So that the government obtains more money for what?

To increase entitlement programs for the poor?

I feel like you want more money but am unclear what your plan might be on what the government should do with that money.

frogger wrote:

In my world, it's not about "handing over some of their profits", it's about the corporations pay their taxes, instead of hiding it offshore and moving it around

So......corporations pay more taxes for what?

So that the government obtains more money for what?

To increase entitlement programs for the poor?

I feel like you want more money but am unclear what your plan might be on what the government should do with that money.

Not to mention the FACT that increased tax revenue gets paid for by consumers (rich and poor) anyway.

frogger wrote:

In my world, it's not about "handing over some of their profits", it's about the corporations pay their taxes, instead of hiding it offshore and moving it around

So......corporations pay more taxes for what?

So that the government obtains more money for what?

To increase entitlement programs for the poor?

I feel like you want more money but am unclear what your plan might be on what the government should do with that money.

How about the government obtains more money to pay down the debt?.....that is how families get out of debt....they obtain more revenue along with cutting expenses. If we can do it so can the government......I would be fine if the closing of loopholes for the wealthy and corporations was contingent on all that revenue going to paying on the debt, and when the debt is zero we can reinstate them. :happier:

archer wrote:

frogger wrote:

In my world, it's not about "handing over some of their profits", it's about the corporations pay their taxes, instead of hiding it offshore and moving it around

So......corporations pay more taxes for what?

So that the government obtains more money for what?

To increase entitlement programs for the poor?

I feel like you want more money but am unclear what your plan might be on what the government should do with that money.

How about the government obtains more money to pay down the debt?.....that is how families get out of debt....they obtain more revenue along with cutting expenses. If we can do it so can the government......I would be fine if the closing of loopholes for the wealthy and corporations was contingent on all that revenue going to paying on the debt, and when the debt is zero we can reinstate them. :happier:

You have to get past the 1 Trillion dollar deficit spending first. That means stop spending.

When you are spending $3 for every $2 you bring in closing a few loopholes doesn't really matter unless you are targeting mortgage interest deduction. Want to put that on the table?

Didn't seem to bother you guys when Bush spent over $3 TRILLION on two unnecessary and unpaid-for wars?!? Where was the outrage then?

But hey, anything to deflect from the fact that the top 1% have gotten 93% of the wealth over the last 30 years, while the 99% of the rest of society have gotten screwed...(Which was the point of the GOTP policies...)