Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests

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HappyCamper replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 26 Sep 2017 17:22 #11

You will not change my mind on this topic it is wrong to disrespect the flag.

I don't care if you are the NFL or Trump just trying to stroke himself!!!!

Too many men and women gave there lives so that we have the freedoms we do and there are other ways to protest.

Last week I was SSSSSSOOOOOO disgusted that I did not watch any of the games.

Take it somewhere else and or live somewhere else.

I know that I do not share the same thoughts as many but what is going on is childish.

Ok, done ranting.

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ramage replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 26 Sep 2017 17:38 #12

Well, if the American flag and national anthem cannot unify the country please tell me what can.

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Rick replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 26 Sep 2017 18:41 #13

The problem I have is when these millionaires go to another country, stand for that country's anthem, then kneel for ours. The main problems black men have in this country is not the flag or even cops, it's the dissolving family unit and leftist governance that has done nothing for them other than make false promises to get their votes. Black men are killing each other at a record pace and the answer is to disrespect the flag of their country? If these rich athletes really cared about making a difference they would do the hard thing which requires being engaged with their communities instead of taking an easy knee and collecting a big paycheck. Now I must be a racist in the eyes of some, but those eyes have been blinded by years of BS from race peddlers like Sharpton and Obama.

Sorry, but these protests will do nothing for the people who really need more than just symbolic gestures.

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HappyCamper replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 26 Sep 2017 20:24 #14

Rick this does not make you a racist watch those shows on cable/HBO and such and well all I will say is they do not promote anything good. Have we let them down well yes, but they are not the only race that has been let down nor will they be the last.

I do not know how to fix this but all I can say as I try and be a good person.

Being a good person does not mean I will always agree but I will respect what you do as you should respect what I feel also.

I do not care who is in office or what the cause is I will never disrespect my country or my flag nor will I ever agree with anyone doing this.

Trump needs to stay off Twitter and Facebook and run the country if he has to be in the lime light all the time then go back to TV there is no place for this being the leader of a country.

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ScienceChic replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 27 Sep 2017 11:11 #15

Some food for thought for you all: did you know that the rules on how to address the flag are a historically recent construct? In the United States, we put an over-emphasis on freedom of speech and allowing symbols to be displayed that other countries do not . Just as there is no official language for the US, nor is there punishment for doing anything with the flag not in accordance with the flag code guidelines - that was struck down as unconstitutional by a 1989 Supreme Court decision. So while it is against flag code guidelines to wear the flag as clothing, nonetheless, you see many people, conservatives especially, doing so. Obviously they do not perceive it as disrespectful despite the fact that it is specifically called out in the flag code not to. Are you offended by that when you see it? If not, then why not? What makes that different than what these players are doing? Because these players are not protesting the flag, nor the anthem, nor our military; they are protesting the unfair and unjust treatment of our fellow Americans, something that was promised in our Constitution but isn't happening in reality and that they are only asking our country to hold itself to. Something we should all be for, frankly.

The point is, how people conduct themselves with the flag in showing respect is different for everyone. Kaepernick and all of these other players who've followed suit did not turn their backs, they did not talk through the anthem, they did not burn or trample on the flag. They knelt. Some sang along with the anthem. Some placed hands on hearts, others simply rested hands on legs. Some bowed their heads, many looked solemnly on. Some stood with arms linked in camraderie and solidarity with teammates. If the person does something different but they do not intend it as disrespectful, and they specifically state so, why not weigh their intentions against your own feelings? When we convict someone of a crime, there is a difference in punishment for intentional (first degree murder) vs unintentional (manslaughter), why not in this situation?

The Rules About How to Address the U.S. Flag Came About Because No One Wanted to Look Like a Nazi
During the National Anthem, Americans are asked to put their right hands over their hearts. But why?
By Erin Blakemore
smithsonian.com
August 12, 2016

While many American Olympians who win gold in Rio place their right hands over their hearts when listening to "The Star-Spangled Banner" on the podium, others do their own thing. Take Michael Phelps, who after winning the 200-meter butterfly earlier this week stood on the podium with his arms by his side, almost overcome with emotion (and then laughter) as he accepted his 20th career Olympic gold medal.

What the Olympians probably don't realize, however, is that the U.S. Flag Code calls for anyone addressing the flag, either during the Pledge of Allegiance or the national anthem, to put their right hands over their hearts. But there's no orientation lesson from the U.S. Olympic Committe that mandates how athletes should appear, which shouldn't be surprising, as Mark Dyreson, Penn State professor and Olympic scholar, tells Bill Plaschke for The Los Angeles Times. This omission is thanks to the rich tradition of freedom of expression in this country. Or, as Dyreson puts it, “In the United States, free speech trumps all.”

But where did the idea to regulate the way Americans choose to respect the flag come from, anyway? As it turns out, the U.S. Flag Code dates back to the not-too-distant year of 1942. The decision to enact began with the Pledge of Allegiance—a ritual that used to involve a salute that required you to raise your right hand, flip your palm down, point it toward the flag in a salute and recite the words. These instructions might seem unthinkable today for obvious reasons—they’re reminiscent of rows of Nazis saluting their Fuhrer. But believe it or not, they date from the beginning of the Pledge itself.

Read more: www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/rules-...#uRIkui4abHri7RY2.99
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! bit.ly/1cGUiGv
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

Some other food for thought: Is the National Anthem Racist?

As to the players getting involved in their communities and working to improve lives, many do that Kaepernick included. He was just named the National Football Players Association MVP for his charitable work.
Colin Kaepernick, still a free agent, named NFLPA Community MVP for charitable work
Colin Kaepernick has donated more than $900,000 to various charities over the last year.
by Adam Stites Sep 15, 2017

“Kaepernick, along with the other 2017 Community MVPs, will also become eligible for this year’s Byron Whizzer White Award, which is the highest honor that the NFLPA can bestow upon a player.”

The award has been given away on a weekly basis for a few years now and anybody who is a dues-paying member of the NFLPA and either on a current roster or actively seeking employment in the NFL is eligible to receive the honor. But Kaepernick winning the award as a free agent is a first.


Making an Impact, Top 10 NFL Player Foundations
Posted on Sunday, July 17th, 2016 at 8:30 am.
Written by David Grazi

In the NFL today, players make an impression on their fans in many ways. Kids want to throw passes like Brady, make spectacular catches like Beckham, and break tackles like Lynch. Most fans don’t realize that off the field, their favorite players make a substantial impact through their charitable foundations; working to change lives for the thousands. The following is our list of the top ten NFL player foundations and the great works being done by these men and their organizations.


And the players's wives get involved and give back as well: Off the Field Players Wives Association

Off the Field is the national football player wives association comprised of talented and diverse wives of active and retired professional football players. Our mission is to unite and empower our members to perform and support philanthropic initiatives that enhance the quality of life for families in our communities.

Established on February 16, 2006...The purpose of the OTF is to have an alliance of women within a network who are fully committed to collectively affect change within themselves as well as their surrounding communities.

Through its dedication to create awareness of children and family needs in communities, and raise funds for local and national charitable organizations that emphasize strengthening the family unit, OTF has contributed more than $850,000 to various charitable organizations since its inception.


And is their cause just and credible? I chose just a few of the more recent ones, but this has been going on I'm sure farther back than I remember of the Rodney King beating in '91. Trayvon Martin, Freddie Gray, Sam DuBose, Philando Castile, Sylville Smith, Tamir Rice, Eric Garner, Michael Brown, Trevon Cole, John Crawford III...
Philando Castile killing: Police video sparks outrage
Police car video of shooting of black motorist released just days after the Minnesota officer was acquitted at trial.
21 June 2017

This one really hit home for me, luckily it didn't end in tragedy but it very could have. This is such a commonplace event that hammers the point that police need better training so as to not over-react. No, I'm not saying every police officer is bad, not even the majority, but this situation shouldn't have even escalated like this and this woman shouldn't have had to fear for her life. The extra precautions she took in how she addressed the cop precisely highlight how their are unequal differences in how blacks are viewed and treated.
Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police
Comply, survive and complain later because panicky cops don’t know how to de-escalate situations
By Tonya Jameson
July 6, 2017

It’s still hard for me to believe that last month I almost became a hashtag — another black person gunned down by a panicky cop.

I don’t have a criminal record.

I shop at Trader Joe’s.

I’m college-educated.

I’m a woman.

As I stared at the officer nervously pointing his gun at me, I realized immediately what he saw: a black person who had no business being in his neighbor’s driveway.

The follow up to this story, of course the cop was found not guilty of violating procedure; however, a civilian board disagreed with that assessment. Civilian board takes KPD chief to task over treatment of black woman by off-duty officer.

Yes, Black America Fears the Police. Here’s Why.
Shots were fired in Long Island, but there was no rush to call 911. It made perfect sense to ProPublica’s Nikole Hannah-Jones.
by Nikole Hannah-Jones March 4, 2015

I turned to check on Hunter, a high school intern from Oregon who was staying with my family for a few weeks, but she was on the phone.

“Someone was just shooting on the beach,” she said, between gulps of air, to the person on the line.

Unable to imagine whom she would be calling at that moment, I asked her, somewhat indignantly, if she couldn’t have waited until we got to safety before calling her mom. “No,” she said. “I am talking to the police.”

My friends and I locked eyes in stunned silence. Between the four adults, we hold six degrees. Three of us are journalists. And not one of us had thought to call the police. We had not even considered it.

We also are all black. And without realizing it, in that moment, each of us had made a set of calculations, an instantaneous weighing of the pros and cons.


Cobb leaders address public over ‘we only shoot black people’ remark
Ben Brasch Rosalind Bentley The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
4:06 p.m Thursday, Aug. 31, 2017

Another mistrial of US officer who killed black man
Case with the same overtones of racial discrimination as other recent police shootings ends in mistrial for second time.
23 June 2017

"The message that is being sent is, if you are black, all the police officer has to do is say they were in fear of their life and they get away with murder because the victim (is) black," the local NAACP said in a statement.

US prosecutors have found it difficult to convict police officers in high-profile shooting cases involving black victims - despite recent incidents being captured on video.

Anger over the failure to find the officers guilty has sometimes boiled over, leading to violent protests.

According to the Guardian newspaper's The Counted database, at least 1,092 people were killed by police in the United States last year.

Nearly a quarter of those killed were African Americans although the group accounts for roughly 12 percent of the total US population.

According to a watchdog group The Sentencing Project, African American men are six times more likely to be incarcerated than white men.


Supreme Court Stays Execution Of Man Convicted By Juror Who Wondered If "Black People Even Have Souls"
Keith Tharpe was set to be executed Tuesday amid questions about the racial bias of one of the jurors who chose to sentence him to death.
Originally posted on September 26, 2017

This story shows that reform can make a difference. Still a ways to go, but taking steps is what matters.
A police officer kills an unarmed black man, and, in Las Vegas, there are no protests
By David Montero and Jaweed Kaleem Contact Reporter
May 19, 2017

It appeared to have all the ingredients for protests, hashtags and calls for justice on 24-hour cable news channels.

An unarmed black man lying on the ground was repeatedly tasered by a police officer. Then he turned over and was put in what looked like a chokehold. He lost consciousness. After being rushed to the hospital, he was pronounced dead.

There was video. There were witnesses. There has been plenty of local media coverage.

But unlike other cases, the death of Tashii Brown on the Las Vegas Strip early Sunday morning at the hands of Officer Kenneth Lopera has barely made a blip nationally — or on the local streets.

Tod Story, executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said he believed the calm could be directly linked to reforms adopted by the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police starting five years ago.

The city was the first in the country to voluntary undergo “collaborative reform” in 2012 under the Department of Justice’s community policing office. Federal officials have since pointed to it as proof that tools and practices like body cameras, deescalation tactics and training on subconscious racial bias are key to solving some of the problems that have pitted law officers and communities against one another across the country.


The hope of a secure and livable world lies with disciplined nonconformists who are dedicated to justice, peace and brotherhood. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

Your scars exist, but it’s your courage that defines you. ~Nalini Singh

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HappyCamper replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 27 Sep 2017 11:40 #16

SC I get what you are saying and that is what those folks believe but I believe different.

To me it is dishonoring my country and flag and just as I respect what they want to do although not agreeing with it. They in turn should respect what I and others believe.

They made their point now move on and do something about it. If they truly want change then this is a great country elect those folks that can help change it. Volunteer for the groups you support or donate to the cause.

They can take a knee every week but how will that change anything? The only way that changes anything for me is I change the channel and will look to support other causes that do not disrespect me and my beliefs.

Something to consider IMHO

I am not racist and I understand things need to change but how does hurting a large part of the populations beliefs help any cause? It is like robbing Peter to pay Paul.

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Blazer Bob replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 27 Sep 2017 13:48 #17

ScienceChic wrote: So while it is against flag code guidelines to wear the flag as clothing, nonetheless, you see many people, conservatives especially, doing so. Obviously they do not perceive it as disrespectful despite the fact that it is specifically called out in the flag code not to. Are you offended by that when you see it? If not, then why not?.[/b]

[/quote]

I was, so some years ago I looked into it. Wearing a facsimile of the
American Flag is not the same as taking an American Flag and tailoring it into a piece of clothing.

That said, it is still something I would not do. Some things are as American as apple pie and some things are pissing in the batter.

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FredHayek replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 12 Nov 2017 13:50 #18

I did notice for Veteran's Day weekend the NFL players are standing for those who served instead of protesting the police and other domestic issues.


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ramage replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 14 Nov 2017 07:50 #19

NFL attendance is significantly down. Empty seats at the Broncos-Patriots game on Sunday night. One has to wonder what effect this public relations nightmare is having on the Broncos" ability to sell the "naming rights" to what is still seen as "Sports Authority Field"?
It is ironic that the logo of a bankrupt company is still displayed.

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FredHayek replied the topic: Colin Kaepernick & Other National Anthem Protests 19 Nov 2017 12:34 #20

Colin Kapernick started his protests against the National Anthrm not by kneeling but sitting down like a spoiled child. The players only adopted the kneeling to look a little more respectful.

The Left wants to make Colin Kapernick into this social justice warrior, but he started this with sitting because he was in a bad mood that day. He wasn't political before that day, was not even registered to vote. He didn't even grow up in the hood. Colin was raised by white parents in a UMC setting.

Marshawn Lynch is one of the few remaining NFL players to continue kneeling, last night in Mexico City, he stood for the Mexican national anthem, but not the US. So clearly he still wants to disrespect America, the land that gives him millions of dollars to play a game. Well next year, when the NFL has less money, and the players get smaller paychecks, they will see the results of their silly tantrums.


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