If we default-poll

Who gets the short end?

We all get the short end. Nobody will ever loan us money again, which means we won't have cash to pay social security checks, won't have money to build roads, etc. Interbank loan rates would skyrocket, so everybody that has an ARM tied to those interest rates would be screwed. The list would be very long on the screwees.

What if I don't think we should screw anybody? What if I think that you meet your obligations no matter how painful? What if I thought that both sides are selfish, whiny little babies that think only of themselves and not of the national well-being?

Kate wrote: We all get the short end. Nobody will ever loan us money again, which means we won't have cash to pay social security checks, won't have money to build roads, etc. Interbank loan rates would skyrocket, so everybody that has an ARM tied to those interest rates would be screwed. The list would be very long on the screwees.

I am betting they will still loan us money, just at a higher rate of interest, or they might require assets, like Mt Rushmore or Manhattan.

Greece still has countries and private banks loaning her money to keep her solvent.

I know a couple people who declared bankruptcy and they were approved for new credit cards.

SS109 wrote:

Kate wrote: We all get the short end. Nobody will ever loan us money again, which means we won't have cash to pay social security checks, won't have money to build roads, etc. Interbank loan rates would skyrocket, so everybody that has an ARM tied to those interest rates would be screwed. The list would be very long on the screwees.

I am betting they will still loan us money, just at a higher rate of interest, or they might require assets, like Mt Rushmore or Manhattan.

Greece still has countries and private banks loaning her money to keep her solvent.

I know a couple people who declared bankruptcy and they were approved for new credit cards.

Are you advocating that for the US.?

I am not advocating default, but I don't think it will be as bad as predicted, many nations have a history of defaulting on their debt and they do fine.

Although it would be pretty funny if we just stopped paying on the notes China has.

The short straw goes to, or should go to, the beneficiaries of the individual welfare initiatives that the federal government should never have gotten involved with in the first place. When you look at the federal budget we either have to eliminate every function of government besides addressing individual welfare or individual welfare to bring the budget back to balance.

Before we get into what programs should be eliminated and who gets the short straw, the conversation ought to be had as to how much of the fruit of the nation's labors the federal government should be entitled to as a regular stipend. 10%? 20%? 50%? More?

The price for raising the limit of the federal government's credit card one final time should be a balanced budget amendment on the national ballot above the candidates for president in 2012. Included in that would be the necessity of garnering a 75% majority -of the people, not the Congress - to raise it ever again. Then, and only then, will the political trickery at massaging numbers end. Let's see how long members of Congress are reelected after they double the current tax burden to raise the $3.5 Trillion they want to spend out of a $14 Trillion national economy. Let's see how long the public supports Social Security and Medicare when they are taxed a quarter of their earnings to keep the Ponzi's solvent - before the income taxes to pay for the rest of the government are even figured.

All partisanship aside, the people who should shoulder the lion's share of the cuts are the ones who created the problem to begin with. Those currently receiving benefits and those who are over 40 years of age. The posterity should be granted the ability to inherit a government free of the debt that others incurred to benefit themselves. Just as we recognize that a person's children are not responsible for the debt incurred by that person prior to their death, so too should we recognize that the posterity of the nation is not responsible for paying the current unfunded liabilities of the general government incurred as we allowed our votes to be purchased by the amount of goodies we would receive in return for our votes. The only word for that expectation is immoral. We had no right to burden them with that debt and it is our obligation to pay back what we borrowed, not theirs. If it means we die sooner because we can't shelter and feed ourselves when we get older, so be it. If it means we die sooner because we receive morphine for pain instead of chemotherapy for our cancers, then so be it. The generations that created the problem the nation now faces are either retired or will be retiring in the next couple of decades. Since we created the problem it is our responsibility to correct the problem, not our children's and not our grandchildren's. We fix the problem at the expense of ourselves, not those who came after us. We are the ones who allowed the programs to continue to be built upon their original faulty foundations. We are the ones who did not insist that the manner in which the programs operate and receive funds was changed when we became aware of just how unstable the foundations were.

If we want to keep the programs for the future, we change the programs so that each generation is responsible for amassing the necessary funds to care for themselves, not the generation which preceded them. We stop creating debt that we expect others, not ourselves, to pay back. We don't allow that can to continue to be kicked down the road as it has for the last 50 to 100 years.

Default is a lie intended to scare us into allowing the status quo to continue onward. We won't default on our credit, we take in enough tax revenue to cover our debt.

It will mean a breaking of the promise between the federal government and the people; however that is a promise that never should have been made to begin with. It's a lot like the promise people make to their Creator in times of stress. God get me out of this and I will go to church every day and twice on Sundays for the rest of my life. He knows that is a promise you can't honor the minute you utter it, just as we all knew that the Ponzi foundation ensured the promises of Social Security and Medicare couldn't be kept. We should be the ones to pay for our own foolishness, not the generations who will follow us.

All generations pay for the previous and the future, just life. We can pay for the debt but not the promises that people depended on. PS you are just cheesy in the way you perceive the world. I paid for the "greatest generation" just reality not some fantasy that you seem to live in.

Right on Printsmith!

Printsmith for President 2012!

Default on all of it, the hell with it. Bring it on!

JMC, there is no way they default. I'm sure a 30 day emergency debt increase is already prepared for an emergency vote. Those Bozos in Washington are stupid, but no way are they going through with this theatrical game of chicken. You'll see.

The only bozos I see are the ones who are too ignorant to understand the impact of a default... Now, THAT'S scary.