The Liberals GOP Twin wrote: Off topic. I'm out of here...
Well... I'm on a red eye tonight... headed for Europe... I'll say hi to the godless Europeans for all of you Probably won't get the chance to post much from there (staying in a rural location) so let's rejoice... you won't be hearing much from me for a couple of weeks. Party time. But I'll be back. I'm contracted to keep driving the conversation against the left right up until the next election, and then I'm out of a part time job. Unless Obama wins, and then I will be able to thank him for creating a new job for me. It's a win-win for everyone.
Safe AND FUN travel Twin! I'm so jealous......I've always wanted to go to Europe. Fill us in when you get back.
" I'll try anything once, twice if I like it, three times to make sure. " Mae West
When I sends prayers to someone affected by a tragedy or loss, I'm not praying to God because I don't prescribe to an organized religion. I do however send prayers out to the Universe and hope that they are able to deal with their loss with the least pain possible.
After the tragic loss of my little brother my mother, who was deeply involved in her church, not only questioned how God could allow this to happen to her child, she was extremely angry at Him. I think she really tried to find her way back to a belief in God, but I don't think she was ever successful.
I don't think anyone's "God" causes disaster's or death, it's just the earth behaving in its extremely powerful ways and birth and death or also a fact of life.
" I'll try anything once, twice if I like it, three times to make sure. " Mae West
I'm wasn't talking about changing the laws of physics. I was talking about the question of whether God causes tornadoes or doesn't. If he has no control over them or other life/death events, then what's the point of praying to him to help you, or others. If he has control over them, why does he let them kill people and what good is asking for his help?
If he created the Heaven and the Earth, why not have a static Earth where there are no earthquakes to kill people?
You missed the point. The laws of physics are complete. Take something away and the universe does not exist. Add something and the universe does not exist.
You are not asking a profound question, but rather the musing of adolescence.
Sunshine Girl wrote: When I sends prayers to someone affected by a tragedy or loss, I'm not praying to God because I don't prescribe to an organized religion. I do however send prayers out to the Universe and hope that they are able to deal with their loss with the least pain possible.
After the tragic loss of my little brother my mother who was deeply involved in her church not only questioned how God could allow this to happen to her child, she was extremely angry at Him. I think she really tried to find her way back to a belief in God, but I don't think she was ever successful.
I don't think anyone's "God" causes disaster's or death, it's just the earth behaving in its extremely powerful ways and birth and death or also a fact of life.
Alfred Lord Tennyson wrestled with this problem most of his adult life after his close friend died while in college.
Many decades later, in reference to his friend, he wrote:
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.
(In Memoriam, 1850, line 27, stanza 4)
This ain't the garden of Eden. It's not perfect. Our eyes are open to the reality of the world. We understand the brute power that the earth has, and that it can snuff us out like blowing out a match.
Personally, I pray as a form of meditation - I'm not asking what to do, or for him to intervene. I'm steeling myself to be able to use the talents I have to the best of my ability, and thanking him for them. I don't need or want him to part the clouds and protect me with his great hand from all harm - although I would like him to do that for my wife and kids
"Whatever you are, be a good one." ~ Abraham Lincoln
I think it's a form of comfort, albeit misguided. How can you say God has done these terrible things to you for a reason? If I had a god, it would be a benevolent god, not something out of prehistory.
Seriously, what I don't understand is those who say God created everything by design plan and watches our day-to-day trials and tribulations and we we pray to him to intervene in something. But at the same time that same God causes tornadoes and other natural disasters that kill people.
So which is it? Can our prayers really do any good in influencing God? Can praying to God give strength to those affected by natural disasters? quote]
How many times have you heard about some church-group headed off for a retreat, or conference, or something. They hit a patch of ice; a drunk driver runs into their bus; their bus driver is driving too fast or goes to sleep at the wheel; the bus blows a tire or the brakes fail, whatever... It's safe to say that they probably prayed before they left for a "safe trip", but now they're all dead... So, assuming they did, that means they were praying for "Divine intervention" to make their trip safe...And now they're all dead.
I think it's a form of comfort, albeit misguided.
Seriously- is it "how dumb can liberals get" day? If you all were a little educated- we would not need to provide the answers to you.
First - Did any of you ever consider that you would not know what pleasure was - without it's opposite, pain? Did you ever consider that you would not know what light is- if it were not for darkness? Did you ever consider that you would not know love - if it were not for hate?
Did you never consider that you would not know good- if it were not for bad? No- you are too simple minded.
Second- did you ever consider- that GOD was not responsible for the earthquakes- and the car crashes? No- you automatically assume thet it was GOD who causes these things, when even a child knows there are other forces- evil forces at play in our lives everyday.
Did you dimwits ever consider that there may be a devil- in addition to the GOD you all seem to want to blame? Because there is a devil too- I see it in all of you GOD haters!
Let's put this into a more understandable form for JSG and others Bear.
Do you, as a parent, prevent your children from experiencing any pain? Do you grant each and every one of their wishes that it is within you ability to grant? Can you protect them when they have removed themselves from your presence? Do you punish your children when they disobey you? Do you forgive them when they seek your forgiveness for that disobedience? Do you comfort them when they are hurting? Do you help them understand why you have made certain decisions when they seek that knowledge? When they wish to participate in sports, ride a bike, or drive a car, does outfitting them with the latest and greatest safety gear mean that no harm will come to them?
We who believe in a Divine Creator believe that we have been created in His image that we may better understand Him ourselves. Just as our best hopes and intentions for our own children fall short because of our human limitations, so to do the hopes and intentions of our Creator for us fall short because of human limitations.
I am sure you have heard the parable before, but it is one of my favorites. The text was taken from a West Wing episode starring Karl Malden as Father Cavanaugh entitled "Take This Sabbath Day"
You know, you remind me of the man that lived by the river. He heard a radio report that the river was going to rush up and flood the town. And that all the residents should evacuate their homes. But the man said, “I’m religious. I pray. God loves me. God will save me.” The waters rose up. A guy in a row boat came along and he shouted, “Hey, hey you! You in there. The town is flooding. Let me take you to safety.” But the man shouted back, “I’m religious. I pray. God loves me. God will save me.” A helicopter was hovering overhead. And a guy with a megaphone shouted, “Hey you, you down there. The town is flooding. Let me drop this ladder and I’ll take you to safety.” But the man shouted back that he was religious, that he prayed, that God loved him and that God will take him to safety. Well... the man drowned. And standing at the gates of St. Peter, he demanded an audience with God. “Lord,” he said, “I’m a religious man, I pray. I thought you loved me. Why did this happen?” God said, “I sent you a radio report, a helicopter, and a guy in a rowboat. What the hell are you doing here?”
Well, I am most certainly not a God hater by any stretch of the imagination. I do believe in evolution. Also, I am of the firm belief that if religion comforts you then that is fine by me and I certainly don't have any desire to tell anyone otherwise. The same holds true for whatever God, religion, or higher power, if any, you choose as yours.
I agree 100% that to experience pleasure you must also have to experience pain/loss. The same goes true for financial good times and bad. What goes up must come down and then swing back up eventually.
When someone experiences great loss all I can do is hope and pray that their journey of pain does not consume them to the point that it makes life unbearable for them.
" I'll try anything once, twice if I like it, three times to make sure. " Mae West
PrintSmith wrote: Let's put this into a more understandable form for JSG and others Bear.
Do you, as a parent, prevent your children from experiencing any pain? Of course not. It is part of life and they have to be able to handle the pain with compassion, understanding, and grace just as I expect them to handle the good times as well. My 12 year old daughter will be attending the funeral of a friend and school mate who just tragically died. It will be a sad and painful experience for her I'm sure, but through it she will find healing and compassion and realize that honoring him and supporting his family will bring a comforting feeling from the sorrow she feels now. This is real life and you can't protect your children from everything.
Do you grant each and every one of their wishes that it is within you ability to grant? No.
Can you protect them when they have removed themselves from your presence? I wish.
Do you punish your children when they disobey you? Of course.
Do you forgive them when they seek your forgiveness for that disobedience? Absolutely!
Do you comfort them when they are hurting? Always.
Do you help them understand why you have made certain decisions when they seek that knowledge? Sometimes yes and sometimes no. My children understand that "No" is a complete sentence and I don't always have the time or desire to explain my decisions. With children sometimes their desire 'for an explanation' is their way of trying to argue and get you to change your mind. BTW Printsmith, I didn't know you had kids. Cool. How many do you have?
When they wish to participate in sports, ride a bike, or drive a car, does outfitting them with the latest and greatest safety gear mean that no harm will come to them? I'm sure we all know that the answer is no.
You don't need to believe in a "Divine Creator" to be a good person and a good parent. I am proof of that.
" I'll try anything once, twice if I like it, three times to make sure. " Mae West
Probably won't get the chance to post much from there (staying in a rural location) so let's rejoice... you won't be hearing much from me for a couple of weeks. Party time. But I'll be back. I'm contracted to keep driving the conversation against the left right up until the next election, and then I'm out of a part time job. Unless Obama wins, and then I will be able to thank him for creating a new job for me. It's a win-win for everyone.
