Abortion Red/Blue Divisions

towermonkey wrote: Of course I was echoing Trump's joke on the matter of 2024. We all know only democrats get to stay in office longer than two terms...<cough> FDR <cough>. As to IVF, I didn't realize it had become an industry like that. Those embryos should be made? Built? not sure what the right word is, only on an as needed basis. One thing I couldn't find in trying to research when these embryos are destroyed was when. Do they have a heartbeat? If so, they should be governed by these laws as that is the one thing that all of the laws had in common. I am pro life to the core, but agree with you that other means should be used to decrease abortions. Laws should be the last thing tried.

"Do they have a heartbeat?" TM, I'm a little at a loss for words here. An embryo that is implanted in a woman's uterus is a ball of 2-8 cells, how in the bloody hell could it possibly have a heart, or a body to contain said heart, in order to have a heartbeat??? A heart itself is comprised of 2x10^9 cells, fyi. You couldn't transplant a fetus that size into a woman's uterus and expect it to survive, it would've had to have been incubated somewhere for weeks and that technology does not exist (and if it did, a woman's body wouldn't be necessary at that point).

I would politely suggest, before making any statement like "those embryos should be made on an as-needed basis," that some basic biology knowledge and finding out exactly what the in vitro fertilization process entails would be extremely helpful. I'm not trying to be an asshole, but this is the problem I see with our society. If people don't even have a basic grasp of the science/biology/physiology/immunology/chemistry/physics behind ovulation/fertilization/gestation/the immune system/genetics/etc, how can they in any way make informed decisions on what our legislators are proposing? FFS, the representative in Ohio wanted ectopic pregnancies to be "transplanted" to the uterus rather than doing the surgery to remove the embryo and save the woman's life - guess what? It's not even a viable surgery, it is impossible to do. The jackass who proposed that legislation has no business whatsoever creating legislation he doesn't understand the ramifications of, nor representing his constituents in any sort of intelligent capacity.

So here's my other issue: now you're also saying that every couple should be forced to birth every single embryo they have created - are you really willing to be that intrusive in people's personal lives to demand how many children they should have to raise? So the government should stay out of our lives except for when it's an issue you agree with, is that it?

Tell you what, if women should be imprisoned for abortions, then men should be jailed for unwanted pregnancies. It's time to start holding both sexes accountable for abortions.

And if it's God's will that we must birth all of these fetuses, then by God, it's His will when your manhood doesn't work anymore either so no more Viagra. Every couple who is incapable of conceiving naturally should resign themselves to adopting or being childless. When we get cancer or heart disease or an infection, it's God's will so no more treatments, you accept your Fate. Let's just shut down every last one of our hospitals, you just have to live with whatever ailments or injuries you have.

Or maybe, instead of us being judgmental, control freak dumbasses and regressing, we start working toward this:
www.facebook.com/Stonekettle/posts/2213900198645371

If we truly -- truly -- believe in the sacredness of life, then we must every single day work to build a civilization where ALL people are valued, where ALL members have access and opportunity without regard to their differences.

If you truly believe that new life to be sacred -- sacred -- do we not then have an obligation both as a nation and as a people to provide for that life? To provide the best possible environment, the possible best future, no matter the expense?

If you TRULY believe human life to be sacred, then it's not enough to demand every conception be carried to term and every baby be born.

No.

If you truly value human life, then you must build a world where that life is truly valued, encouraged and celebrated for itself.

If you allow no exemptions for rape, then you are morally obligated to work diligently and aggressively to ensure rape does not happen. You must change society, you must change how we think, you must change the entrenched power structure, you must change how we see each other. No exceptions. No excuses.