Toll roads

BearMtnHIB wrote:

AspenValley wrote: Kind of surprised to see so many "righties" being against toll roads. The conservative position is usually that whomever benefits from something directly should be the one paying for it, as opposed to spreading out the cost to everyone whether they benefit or not. Interesting.

One or the other - but what we have now - is both.

I'm ok with toll roads if they remove the tax from gasoline.

We pay 43.4 cents tax for every gallon of gas consumed in Colorado. All of that money is supposed to be building and maintaining our roads.

Take away the 43.4 cents and I'll be ok with toll roads- just dont ask me to double pay for what I'm already paying for.

Yes, you pay 43.4, but 18.4 of that is Federal tax, and 22-cents is Colorado State Tax; (20.5 for diesel). If a toll-road is a state project, then the 22-cents is all that is going to it, unless the Feds are putting in some sort of matching funds. "All of that money building and maintaining our roads" is not true. Only the 22-cents of it at the state level is going toward that.

The 43.4 is not going to go away...

AspenValley wrote: Kind of surprised to see so many "righties" being against toll roads. The conservative position is usually that whomever benefits from something directly should be the one paying for it, as opposed to spreading out the cost to everyone whether they benefit or not. Interesting.

Nice generalization there AV. As for my conservative opinion, I could care less about toll roads. They are usually built with a toll in mind and as long as there is an alternate route without a toll, I'm free to decide whether to spend more time on the road or pay a fee to get there faster. Nothing is built for free.

I drove to Parker once and took a toll road and was charged a few bucks more because I was towing a 200 pound empty trailer. I will avoid Parker like the plague now.

Doesn't the route of this toll road fall within the area near Rocky Flats that is known to have been polluted by plutonium? And if so, the construction of that road will provide a means of releasing some it into the air for people to breathe?

Martin Ent Inc wrote: Chain Gangs...

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: TOTALLY AGREE!!!!

BTW, I think this is a good place to add this...

http://money.msn.com/tax-planning/hidden-taxes-you-pay-every-day.aspx
Hidden taxes you pay every day 4/15/2011 1:19 PM ET By Judi Hasson, MSN Money
Government takes a cut of just about anything involving money -- and that raises the cost to you. There's the broom tax, the girdle tax, the tackle box tax . . .

"To make it easier for domestic manufacturers to compete, the government may impose tariffs on imports ranging from brooms to bicycles, making their prices artificially high.
According to the U.S. International Trade Commission, here are some items whose prices swell with import taxes:
• Bicycles: 30%
• Certain infant formula: 30%
• Flashlights: 125%
• Girdles: 20%
• Brooms: 32%
• Cotton hammocks: 14%
• Table linens: 113%
• Peanut butter: 132%
• Office or school supplies: 53%
• Golf shoes: 35%
• Cameras: 20%
Besides tariffs, Congress uses subsidies to manipulate the price of goods and produce to help American producers.. These costs are sprinkled over many products, such as candy, breakfast cereal and other packaged food.
"Who pays for these subsidies? All of us do -- when we pay our taxes that are used to pay the subsidies to domestic producers and when we purchase a Milky Way as a midafternoon pick-me-up," says Andy Pike, a tax professor at American University's law school.

• If you want to take a romantic cruise down the Potomac River -- or any other U.S. waterway -- there's a tax of about $3 on anyone transported by boat.
• Here's what you pay for an airline flight: a 7.5% tax on a domestic ticket, a $3.70 tax for each segment of a flight and, since the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, a $2.50 security charge on every segment and a variety of other fees imposed by the Department of Homeland Security. That's in addition to a $16.30 international arrival tax, a $16.30 international departure tax and a passenger-facility charge of up to $4.50.
• Fishing isn't free, either. A fisherman pays 10% of the sales price on sport-fishing equipment. Outboard motors and tackle boxes are taxed at 3%. Archers are hit, too. The federal tax on arrows is 45 cents per shaft, although certain wooden arrows are exempt. Quivers and broadhead arrows are taxed at 11%.
• Buyers of handguns pay 10% of the sales price to the feds; other firearms, along with ammunition, are taxed at 11%.
• The federal tax on a pack of cigarettes was 39 cents until Feb. 4, 2009, when it was increased to $1.01 per pack. State cigarette taxes vary, ranging from a low of 17 cents a pack in Missouri and 30 cents in Virginia to $4.35 a pack in New York and $3.46 in Rhode Island.
• A childhood DPT vaccine (diphtheria, pertussis, tetanus) has a 75-cent charge per shot, paid into a trust fund for those harmed by the shot.
• Here's one the federal government rarely collects: a 2% tax on unauthorized wagering. Yes, it's on the books, and it is directed at criminal cartels. When you bet legally, there's a 0.25% tax on every bet you place.
It's not room and board -- it's 'income'
Some things are not taxed specifically but are listed by the IRS as income -- meaning you'll pay in April:
• Thrilled that your son or daughter got a college scholarship? There may be federal taxes on some parts of the award. Room, board and pocket money are taxable, though tuition is not.
• The next time you find buried treasure, remember to report it as regular income.
• Even if you're so broke that creditors have forgiven part of your debt, you are not off the hook. The forgiven portion of your debt is "income" and may be taxable as such. Note that there are exceptions if the debt was secured by your principal residence or you declare bankruptcy or are insolvent at the time.
• You may feel lucky in Las Vegas, hit the lottery at home or have a good day at the racetrack, but all winnings are taxable as regular income.
• If you take a bribe or steal property, it's income unless you give it back before the tax year is over. Just a tip.
"People think they are overtaxed right now," says Tom Giovanetti, the president of the Institute for Policy Innovation in Texas, "and they don't know half of the story.""

Yes, you pay 43.4, but 18.4 of that is Federal tax, and 22-cents is Colorado State Tax; (20.5 for diesel). If a toll-road is a state project, then the 22-cents is all that is going to it, unless the Feds are putting in some sort of matching funds. "All of that money building and maintaining our roads" is not true. Only the 22-cents of it at the state level is going toward that.

The 43.4 is not going to go away...

Had to leave yesterday before I made all my points on this topic- yes LJ- 18.4 is federal taxes and 22 for state - adds up to the 43.4.

So- follow my logic here.....
The 18.4 is supposed to come back to Colorado in the form of funding for roads- if it is not held for ransom by the feds until we do what they want us to do- i.e. change speed limits or lower the DUI standards.

The 22 cent state tax is supposed to be building state roads and maintaining state roads- this is the reason stated to justify the tax. This money can also be combined with the federal money for projects.

There is no shortage what-so-ever in Colorado for paving and maintaining our roads. In addition to the money collected everytime we buy gasoline- The state now collects almost twice as much vehicle registration money as it did last year. This new tax will increase every year for 4 or 5 more years.

In addition to all that money- The American reinvestment act is flooding the state with money for roads. Colorado has been awarded $5,365,726,115 - yea - 5 billion dollars. So far we have used $2,581,370,443.

The state has no shortage of money for roads. Period.

The transfer of federal funds back to the states for highway purposes has NEVER been a 1-to-1 proposition...NEVER... And only small portions are based on state's non-compliance with congressional mandates for safety standards.

Yes, there is a shortage in Colorado state funds for road maintenance and bridge maintenance. This is primarily because with the recession, job losses and price of fuel, there are less miles being driven, by fewer drives, and in some cases, with more fuel-efficient cars. Ergo, there are fewer gallons of gas & diesel being sold with that 22cent/gal tax being collected.

Period.

It is my understanding that a lot of toll roads are "private" roads. That is, they are paid for and built by a private company, and the tolls collected are used by the private company that owns and/or maintains the road to do just that.

Or, the toll road is a temporary toll road for a specific length of time, or until enough tolls have been collected to pay for the construction of the road. Once the costs for building the road have been paid off, then the road ceases to be a toll road.

These are the scenarios I've heard of or seen. From what I understand the toll monies collected do not go anywhere else except to pay off and/or maintain the toll road. And state monies generated through vehicle registrations, gas taxes, or whatever are not used to maintain the toll road.

I do believe there is a better way for Colorado to manage the money to maintain the roadways in the state. And in some cases, tolls may be the way to do it.

I also believe some of the things CDOT does in maintaining these roads is wasteful...case in point: there is a place on the south side of Hoosier Pass where the road looks like it is falling away from the slope. There are cracks in the road and the road has fallen a little. This has been this way for over 3 years. The first year, it was paved over, but the paving wasn't done properly and the next winter the snowplows tore the hell out of the road when they caught the edge of the paving patch. The next year, it was re-paved again...this time they took up what was on the road and replaced it, but they didn't shore up the mountain underneath to keep it from happening again. This summer, they are going to have to repair it again. It seems to me that they could have studied the reason for the problem the first year, and spent a little more money and time actually fixing the problem (shoring up the mountain or something) instead of spending as much as they have on these temporary fixes. Furthermore, the second year they fixed it, they decided to re-pave that whole part of the road. So...the week before they started re-paving the stripers re-painted the lines and then the road construction company tore the pavement and newly painted stripes up. Then they re-paved it and re-striped it. Why???

Lowest bidder? lol

(I agree with you, by the way...)

daisypusher wrote: Doesn't the route of this toll road fall within the area near Rocky Flats that is known to have been polluted by plutonium? And if so, the construction of that road will provide a means of releasing some it into the air for people to breathe?

NICE JOB, daisypusher, of course it will, but don't worry it's down wind from us, and just goes into the bread basket of the U.S., No biggie.

AspenValley wrote: Kind of surprised to see so many "righties" being against toll roads. The conservative position is usually that whomever benefits from something directly should be the one paying for it, as opposed to spreading out the cost to everyone whether they benefit or not. Interesting.

A toll is just another form of taxation, which conservatives are deadset against. Don't you get it?