Earth Day April 22, 2011

22 Apr 2011 21:26 #11 by Moonchild
Replied by Moonchild on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011
Mr. TPP, how does it make him a hypocrite to the environmental movement to have committed murder?

And what does his political affiliation have to do with being a murderer?

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22 Apr 2011 21:57 #12 by chickaree
Replied by chickaree on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011
Gaylord Nelson of Wisconsin was the originator of Earth day I believe.

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24 Apr 2011 11:25 #13 by ScienceChic
chickaree - apparently they were co-originators. The story that TPP linked described the other guy who is accused of killing his girlfriend not long after that first Earth Day and fled to avoid arrest. His involvement with Earth Day was then downplayed by those who continued supporting the event. Possibly murdering someone does not make them a leftist hypocrite, as TPP asserts, just a potential criminal (and criminals are not ALL left-leaning people, as he well knows, but likes to get his digs in). Don't'cha TPP! :wink:

Sorry this is late; I meant to post it earlier - info on paying for carbon offsets that is tax deductible and stays here in CO. We pay to offset all of our vehicles' gas usage and our home energy usage every year - their website has the calculator if you know how many miles you drove and how many kilowatt hours you paid for (it's listed in our Xcel bill, I would guess that it's on the IREA bills as well).
http://campaign.r20.constantcontact.com ... cinV_pE%3D
The Colorado Carbon Fund. Earth Week Offsets: April 18-24, 2011

"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

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24 Apr 2011 11:41 #14 by Obam me
Replied by Obam me on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011

info on paying for carbon offsets that is tax deductible and stays here in CO. We pay to offset all of our vehicles' gas usage and our home energy usage every year - their website has the calculator if you know how many miles you drove and how many kilowatt hours you paid for (it's listed in our Xcel bill, I would guess that it's on the IREA bills as well).



Seriously?? rofllol rofllol rofllol

Hook, line & sinker... :lol:

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24 Apr 2011 13:49 #15 by ScienceChic
Bought exactly what hook, line, and sinker Trouble? Do you think that I just blindly accepted AGW and hopped full-tilt onto the bandwagon? Apparently you haven't gotten to know me very well yet! :biggrin:

As this was B2B (Before 285Bound!), I am posting 2 threads that I started simultaneously on two other community forums back in February of last year sort of documenting my journey studying climate change, where I've found some of my info, and what it would take to change my mind - something that no one has yet to find any evidence that fits my criteria. I very certainly did not automatically believe that AGW was occurring, or man-made but have since come to accept it after reviewing the scientific evidence, and the rebuttals from those opposed to the idea. I also have not and do not support cash-for-clunkers, ethanol subsidies, or cap-and-trade.

Out of curiosity, on what do you base your beliefs? Have you researched the opposing viewpoint to control for your biases?

http://www.pinecam.com/phpBB2/viewtopic ... hange+mind

http://s1.zetaboards.com/285Freetalk/topic/2950018/1/

"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

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24 Apr 2011 14:32 #16 by Obam me
Replied by Obam me on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011
I guess I'm just not into buying my way out of personal responsibility and I just don't feel any carbon guilt. And if Al Gore is for it, I'm against it. He's such an idiot!


Gore's 'carbon offsets' paid to firm he owns
Critics say justification for energy-rich lifestyle serves as way for former VP to profit
http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=40445

Al Gore defends his extraordinary personal energy usage by telling critics he maintains a "carbon neutral" lifestyle by buying "carbon offsets," but the company that receives his payments turns out to be partly owned and chaired by the former vice president himself.

Read more: Gore's 'carbon offsets' paid to firm he owns http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=40445#ixzz1KTUDBSUb



Carbon Offsets: Government Warns of Fraud Risk
by Christopher Joyce
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... d=17814838

There is something new to feel guilty about: carbon.

This new form of remorse is found among people who think that their lifestyle — driving, plane trips or maybe just leaf-blowing — adds too much climate-warming carbon dioxide to the air.

The guilty can now buy something called a "carbon offset." Essentially, you pay someone else to reduce or "offset" carbon emissions equal to your own.

It's a booming new trade, but the federal government is worried that consumers are getting ripped off.


BURNETT: Carbon offsets scam
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/200 ... sets-scam/

However, if Congress does act, it should be skeptical of the merits of carbon offset schemes. Thus far, they have proven expensive and open to fraud and abuse.


Carbon offset schemes are of questionable value
http://environmentalresearchweb.org/cws ... nion/30246

This lack of sustainability points to the essence of the problem. Our current carbon footprint is too high, and the only long-term solution is to reduce carbon emissions, not to compensate them by carbon offset schemes. This is also why carbon offset schemes are opposed from an ethical viewpoint. They are considered as paying someone else for reducing their greenhouse gas emissions and, as such, buying your way out of responsibility. And the schemes may distract attention from the real problem of how we reduce our own emissions. This is a double challenge for scientists. Finding new ways to decrease our society's greenhouse gas emissions is a major scientific challenge that merits our full attention. Considering whether the scientific value of a trip to the other end of the world outweighs the use of resources and the carbon footprint is a much more personal challenge.


Carbon offset
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_offset

Additionality and lack of regulation in the voluntary marketSeveral certification standards exist, offering variations for measuring emissions baseline, reductions, additionality, and other key criteria. However, no single standard governs the industry, and some offset providers have been criticized on the grounds that carbon reduction claims are exaggerated or misleading. Problems include:[61][62]

Widespread instances of people and organizations buying worthless credits that do not yield any reductions in carbon emissions.
Industrial companies profiting from doing very little – or from gaining carbon credits on the basis of efficiency gains from which they have already benefited substantially.
Brokers providing services of questionable or no value.
A shortage of verification, making it difficult for buyers to assess the true value of carbon credits.

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24 Apr 2011 14:44 #17 by TPP
Replied by TPP on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011

Moonchild wrote: Mr. TPP, how does it make him a hypocrite to the environmental movement to have committed murder?

And what does his political affiliation have to do with being a murderer?


As most "Preachers" he preached Peace & Love for the everything... Yet he kills if it suits him frick'in Hypocrite...
Same goes to the popes, cardinals, preists, minsters and preachers that DO NOT teach the TRUTH about the CHRIST!
Same with the frick'in a-holes that burn down resorts, and break free animals, and throw blood on REAL furs, f**K them all.
These same hyocrites will going skiing, Some eat the same animals we experiment on, and throwning blood on fur, where do they get it, from themselves, I think NOT they kill an animal to get it.

DOMASTIC TERRORISTISM
NO 2 WAYS ABOUT IT! YET, they scream mcvay, (a loon, NO doubt) why aren't the others brough up?????

Screaw him and his followers, they've F-'d-up more of the EARTH than any other humans have... HYOCRITES ALL.

Sorry, NOT done with RANT!
Have you ever seen the Frick'in mess after an environmantalist rally, is disgusting. I've cleaned them up!
Have you been at 10k and seen trash that you than picked up and kicked out, I kicked out (over the years) Hundreds of pounds. I really don't know what I'd do if I saw the disrecept that some of these "enviromentalist" show to the earth & animals in the area, if I saw them doing it, GOD help them. Because I fear they would never be found again.
It's all Frick'in talk and NO ACTION, Screaw'em all, and my God put his wrath upon them!
How many NOT DEAD fires have you put out? Did you see the Frick'in a-holes in Steamboat for some hippie fest Bullsh*T? They drive they're frick'in vans & VW vans, over ground, that was NEVER even steeped on a year ago. Now, there's tire runts, & trash. F**K'em! They broke some many laws that Steambaot cops had to transfer them elsewhere. Sickens REAL lovers of Nature.
So, instead of going to rallies and "Celabrating Earth Day, get off your fat a$$es and pick-up trash, and clean up parks, don't Talk about it DO IT!

Man, That felt GOOD!
Better now.

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24 Apr 2011 15:35 #18 by Obam me
Replied by Obam me on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011
I switched the rankings around a little just for fun but in honor of Earth Day 2011, here are the Top 10 Environmental Scams:

10. Global warming alarmism
9. Earth Day
8. Cap and trade
7. Green jobs
6. Environmental activism
5. Wind power hypocrisy
4. Hollywood hypocrisy
3. Carbon trading
2. Greenwashing

And the Number one Top Environmental Scam/Scam Artist/Joke....

1. Al Gore

Al Gore transformed his movie An Inconvenient Truth into a mega-money maker (see No. 4). What is truly inconvenient about his Nobel Prize-winning film were the 11 falsehoods that it contained, as determined by a British court, including the misleading suggestion that Hurricane Katrina was caused by global warming.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=43111


Hook. Line. Sinker. :Koolaid:

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24 Apr 2011 15:50 #19 by ScienceChic

Trouble wrote: I guess I'm just not into buying my way out of personal responsibility and I just don't feel any carbon guilt. And if Al Gore is for it, I'm against it. He's such an idiot!

If you'll notice in my posts, there's never anything about Al Gore. He's not a scientist and not someone that I reference as being a good standard to aspire to. He's done much to bring attention to the issue, but he's also lived somewhat hypocritically (yes, he travels a lot to spread his message, and offsets that, but he owns multiple homes that while he may update to be carbon-neutral, he doesn't exactly exemplify a minimal lifestyle).

I also agree that there are many issues with carbon offsets. The first being that it is imperative for the consumer to research the organization and make sure that their money is going toward actual carbon reductions. That's why I support the Colorado Carbon Fund.
What is an offset: http://www.coloradocarbonfund.org/index ... an-offset/
Project Criteria: http://www.coloradocarbonfund.org/index ... evelopers/

The second big issue is one that you mentioned: that people are lazy and use them merely to "make themselves feel better" about their lifestyle and don't try to reduce their carbon footprint first which should be the priority. I haven't been able to find the time to respond to the thread that Nmysys started in the Courthouse that y'all jumped all over me for my water usage, etc. but first and foremost, my family has attempted to reduce our emissions and carbon footprint. We moved out of the mountains, and our dream home, in order to reduce the time, miles, gas, and maintenance spent in/on the car (I can't access my old online records right now, but if I'm remembering right, the miles I put on my car went from over 20,000/year to 10,000/year). We have been updating our new house, which was built in 1992, as we can afford projects to make it more energy efficient - done or on the docket:
improve insulation
seal up cracks
newer energy efficient furnace and A/C unit (and I seriously cut back on the A/C use last year - I like it hot, and think it's better/healthier for our bodies to respond to a wider range of temps)
stove in basement
low-flow toilets in every bathroom
brand new fully insulated garage door (the old one had such big cracks that you could see daylight through it and on windy days wouldn't close - the wind could blow hard enough to shake it and make the sensors think they'd hit something)
energy efficient front-load washing machine
energy efficient and water-saving dishwasher
CFL's or LED lights in every light (I love the new LED's, just wish they'd come down in price and come out in brighter options, but even as expensive as they are they still save money in the long run and 40W equivalent or less is fine for most light fixtures)
switch to tankless water heater
hot water pump to instantly deliver hot water so as to waste less
new triple-pane windows with Low E coating
new double- or triple-honeycomb blinds on east, west, and south facing windows
compost bin out back for making compost for the garden (I've gotten our family of 4 to a single 13gal bag of garbage/week)
buy canning shares from local CSA and can/freeze a good portion of produce for winter consumption
and I shovel snow almost all the time rather than use the snowblower - better exercise and no gas required!, same thing with leaves - I rake by hand rather than using a noise-polluting leaf blower.

"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

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24 Apr 2011 15:52 #20 by Obam me
Replied by Obam me on topic Earth Day April 22, 2011
Just for grins...I'll just post the really funny ones!

Fifteen Foolish Forecasts: How did environmentalists get it so wrong on Earth Day 1970?
http://www.ihatethemedia.com/fifteen-fo ... h-day-1970

For example, the predictions made at the first Earth Day in 1970 were wrong. No, wrong isn’t a strong enough word. They were spectacularly wrong. Let’s cover all the tenses and say they were wrong, they are wrong, and then make our own prediction and say they will be wrong in the future.

“The world has been chilling sharply for about twenty years. If present trends continue, the world will be about four degrees colder for the global mean temperature in 1990, but eleven degrees colder in the year 2000. This is about twice what it would take to put us into an ice age.”
• Kenneth Watt, Ecologist

“Civilization will end within 15 or 30 years unless immediate action is taken against problems facing mankind.”
• George Wald, Harvard Biologist

“Scientists have solid experimental and theoretical evidence to support…the following predictions: In a decade, urban dwellers will have to wear gas masks to survive air pollution…by 1985 air pollution will have reduced the amount of sunlight reaching earth by one half….”
• Life Magazine, January 1970

“By the year 2000, if present trends continue, we will be using up crude oil at such a rate…that there won’t be any more crude oil. You’ll drive up to the pump and say, `Fill ‘er up, buddy,’ and he’ll say, `I am very sorry, there isn’t any.’”
• Kenneth Watt, Ecologist







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