California Couple Fined $300 for Holding Home Bible Studies

BearMtnHIB wrote: No-one is going to open a 7-11 next door to me. If they did it would go out of business. No one is starting a garbage dump- or a septic farm- or a mine.

We could contemplate for days about all the things that "could" happen- but have never happened and are not likely to ever happen- So do we need a law for every possible senerio?

I say no we don't. I moved out of Boulder county because they seem to have a restriction for everything there. They have literally spent year after year inventing possible senerios of things to restrict, and then they made a zoning restriction for them all. Boulder's zoning and building code is as thick as a phone book. Virtually every homeowner there is in violation of somthing now- and most homes are in multiple violations, it's just a matter of "if and when" the county wants to start enforcing and harassing it's property owners. Stories like this one come up when the county singles out a homeowner with court cases and fines.

A zoning retsriction like the one here literally prohibits a homeowner from having a birthday party- a BBQ- any get together at a private home. Is that the world you want to live in? If so there are communities where you will fit right in.

I do not want to live like that- I bought my property in an area without those kinds of encumbrances for a reason. I had and have an expectation of freedom from restrictions like this.

I have a right to presume my freedom to have a BBQ or a birthday party or a bible study get together at my house without my local government requiring a fee or permit or permission. People like you do not have a right to move in next to me and start adding restrictions where there were none before, but that's exactly what is happening to all of us- they add more every year.

I'm interested in retaining and preserving the rights I had when I purchased my property, I'm not so worried about my neighbor's bible study that I would give up my own right to have a BBQ at my place. Would you really give up your right in order to restrict your neighbors?

I'm not interested in relinquishing any freedom that I have a presumptive right to expect. I'm not interested in your nanny state.

This issue isn't about your property BearMtnHIB.....if you bought property without any zoning restrictions, fine......do what you want. But, if you bought property that had zoning restrictions then you abide by those......these people did not have to buy in that neighborhood, they chose to, and I would bet the restrictions were in place. Now they want to change the rules and not obey the law. It has been pointed out that there are right ways to change the restrictions or get an exemption.......if you don't do that and flaunt the law you will be fined. Simple really, and it has nothing at all to do with why they broke the law, only that they did.

If the city has a zoning ordinance against such large gatherings in a residential neighborhood, how can you say it's about religion? Sounds more like conspiracy theory to say that the city is suppressing religious gatherings, rather than this was a simple case of violating city regulations. For that many people why not use the church, or other commercial space designed to handle that many people and cars?

How can you say it's about religion? In this case- The city actually is suppressing religious gatherings because the gathering in question here is a religious one. They didn't ticket the mommy having a birthday party for her 9 year old- this was a bible study group.

I hope that you can understand the concept- even if you are a little twisted off reality by being a liberal!

BearMtnHIB wrote:

If the city has a zoning ordinance against such large gatherings in a residential neighborhood, how can you say it's about religion? Sounds more like conspiracy theory to say that the city is suppressing religious gatherings, rather than this was a simple case of violating city regulations. For that many people why not use the church, or other commercial space designed to handle that many people and cars?

How can you say it's about religion? In this case- The city actually is suppressing religious gatherings because the gathering in question here is a religious one. They didn't ticket the mommy having a birthday party for her 9 year old- this was a bible study group.

I hope that you can understand the concept- even if you are a little twisted off reality by being a liberal!

There's no mention of a birthday party in the article. However, they did say this:

A spokeswoman for the city of San Juan Capistrano stressed that local authorities were not trying to prohibit home Bible study.

Instead, she said the city fined the Fromms for transforming a residential area into a place where people regularly assemble.

BearMtnHIB wrote:

If the city has a zoning ordinance against such large gatherings in a residential neighborhood, how can you say it's about religion? Sounds more like conspiracy theory to say that the city is suppressing religious gatherings, rather than this was a simple case of violating city regulations. For that many people why not use the church, or other commercial space designed to handle that many people and cars?

How can you say it's about religion? In this case- The city actually is suppressing religious gatherings because the gathering in question here is a religious one. They didn't ticket the mommy having a birthday party for her 9 year old- this was a bible study group.

I hope that you can understand the concept- even if you are a little twisted off reality by being a liberal!

If the mommy has a birthday party for 50 people twice a week, every week, you betcha the neighbors will complain and she will get fined. It's NOT about religion.....not at all....it's about violating zoning codes....and guess what.....you don't get an exemption from the law just because your meeting happens to be religious.

Instead, she said the city fined the Fromms for transforming a residential area into a place where people regularly assemble.

And I think they can fight that because there is a constitutional right called - "freedom of assembly". In oither words I don't think a city can tell you where you can assemble legally.

Incidentally- my property did not have many zoning restrictions when I bought it, but many more have been added since I bought thge property which is what my main complaint is here. We are losing rights everyday, and it's up to all of us to fight to preserve our presumptive property rights when we catch our local government trying to take them away. They can have their phone book size rules in Boulder county- I just want to keep my rights as I presumed them when I bought my land.

My zoning allows a business on my property with a few exceptions- I can't have a hog farm or raise swine here, and I can't have a mechanics shop. Most new zoning does not allow a business of any kind on the property- so many of you with a home business may already be in violation of the zoning laws.

I have a few neighbors near me who have big parties with more than 50 people and make plenty of noise. I'd rather live in this neighborhood where I'm free to do the same and can paint my house whatever damn color I want. I'm also lucky not to have uptight anal neighbors.

Seems like Kate and Archer are for anything that gives more control to the government, and will argue it over logic and freedom, to the death. I predict that the Fromm's will actually win out, between the right to assembly and the religious freedom. No one is going to tell me how many people I can invite to my home any more than they can tell me what I can do in my home, of course I live in Bailey, Colorado not in Northern Mexico.

What MORE control did the guberment gain in this issue? The zoning codes and regs were ALREADY in place. They should have known the codes in advance of holding the meetings and requested a variance.

Whatevergreen wrote: What MORE control did the guberment gain in this issue? The zoning codes and regs were ALREADY in place. They should have known the codes in advance of holding the meetings and requested a variance.

I don't think that they could have codes preventing people from having a certain number of guests in their home. You don't need a zoning variance for having people in your home.