Paul Ryan - Government did not help?

Something the Dog Said wrote: hypocritialbill who claims that Ryan earned the money from a government job while also claiming that there are no such things as government jobs.

HUH?? Where have I ever said there is no such thing as government jobs? I just made a couple long posts showing how the people who work for the government are also doing the government a service, not the other way around.

You just can't answer my simple point... Does the government (the people) serve the government employee (soldier, cop, congressman) or does the government employee do a service for the government (the people)?. I don't see any libs backing you up because you have it backwards.

That's why they call it PUBLIC SERVICE.

PrintSmith wrote: Your point is flawed - Romney never said that the government doesn't help. Given the fatal fallacy that exists with that as your beginning point, there is no purpose served by continuing the discussion once that fatal fallacy is exposed.

So you are now spinning that Romney does say that government help is necessary to succeed? Romney has repeatedly stated that government does not help build prosperity, that government does not help build success. But then his VP pick has used government help for his entire success.

CritiKalBill wrote:

Something the Dog Said wrote: hypocritialbill who claims that Ryan earned the money from a government job while also claiming that there are no such things as government jobs.

HUH?? Where have I ever said there is no such thing as government jobs? I just made a couple long posts showing how the people who work for the government are also doing the government a service, not the other way around.

You just can't answer my simple point... Does the government (the people) serve the government employee (soldier, cop, congressman) or does the government employee do a service for the government (the people)?. I don't see any libs backing you up because you have it backwards.

That's why they call it PUBLIC SERVICE.

Bill, Bill, poor Bill,

Read your signature line. According to you, the government does not create jobs. If the government does not create jobs, then how can there be government jobs? Hmm? In regard to your circular post, in any employment situation, the employer pays the employee for their work. Hopefully that work is sufficient for the employer to recoup their expense in that worker. Do you believe that the taxpayer got their over million dollars spent on Ryan in passing a bill that renamed a post office and a bill on excise taxes concerning arrows? Or in his votes to bust the deficit in granting unfunded tax breaks, auto bailouts, bank bailouts, unfunded budgets for two wars, and on and on.

Govt is overhead on a society. Does that mean no govt? Of course not. It means govt can only be a certain percentage of overall GDP. People still work for the govt to fulfill this work. But they, just like overhead in any business, produce nothing. Without the work being done in the private sector, there is no need for them. Being a representative is not "govt help". It is a job, one you apply for, and in his case, get voted in.

You can't keep setting up these false premises in the hopes of being able to predetermine the parameters of the debate Dog. Ryan hasn't used government help for his entire success. There are a lot of people that receive the same help when their father dies that are not nearly as successful as Ryan has been. If it was the government's help that is responsible for Ryan's success, then everyone who received that help would be as successful as Ryan has been. Care to try and build an argument that isn't so fatally flawed as a result of a fatally flawed premise as your current one is?

Something the Dog Said wrote:

CritiKalBill wrote:

Something the Dog Said wrote: hypocritialbill who claims that Ryan earned the money from a government job while also claiming that there are no such things as government jobs.

HUH?? Where have I ever said there is no such thing as government jobs? I just made a couple long posts showing how the people who work for the government are also doing the government a service, not the other way around.

You just can't answer my simple point... Does the government (the people) serve the government employee (soldier, cop, congressman) or does the government employee do a service for the government (the people)?. I don't see any libs backing you up because you have it backwards.

That's why they call it PUBLIC SERVICE.

Bill, Bill, poor Bill,

Read your signature line. According to you, the government does not create jobs. If the government does not create jobs, then how can there be government jobs? Hmm? In regard to your circular post, in any employment situation, the employer pays the employee for their work. Hopefully that work is sufficient for the employer to recoup their expense in that worker. Do you believe that the taxpayer got their over million dollars spent on Ryan in passing a bill that renamed a post office and a bill on excise taxes concerning arrows? Or in his votes to bust the deficit in granting unfunded tax breaks, auto bailouts, bank bailouts, unfunded budgets for two wars, and on and on.

The government can not, nor will it ever create jobs that are not a taxpayer expense. Sure, Obama and his minions could create a big government program that requires thousands of nnew government employees, but where does that money come from? It comes from the private sector businesses that hire the employees and they all pay taxes to pay for those government jobs. I suppose I could have been more specific in my signature, but I figured most of you were up to date on who creates the jobs that create the wealth.

PrintSmith wrote: You can't keep setting up these false premises in the hopes of being able to predetermine the parameters of the debate Dog. Ryan hasn't used government help for his entire success. There are a lot of people that receive the same help when their father dies that are not nearly as successful as Ryan has been. If it was the government's help that is responsible for Ryan's success, then everyone who received that help would be as successful as Ryan has been. Care to try and build an argument that isn't so fatally flawed as a result of a fatally flawed premise as your current one is?

Ryan went to college on government programs (SS and student loans), worked for Brownback as a congressional staffer, and collected a government paycheck since he was 28. His success is due to assistance from the government. Whether or not others have been able to meet his success in utilizing government assistance to achieve his success is irrelevant to the point that Ryan utilized government assistance for his success. Your sophoric comments can not contradict this simple fact.

Something the Dog Said wrote: Do you believe that the taxpayer got their over million dollars spent on Ryan in passing a bill that renamed a post office and a bill on excise taxes concerning arrows? Or in his votes to bust the deficit in granting unfunded tax breaks, auto bailouts, bank bailouts, unfunded budgets for two wars, and on and on.

Tax rate reductions resulted in an increase in tax revenues as a percentage of GDP Dog - the figures are quite clear on that. Prior to the tax rate reductions passed in 2003, federal revenue as a percentage of GDP was down in each of the three previous years. It was down by 4% before the tax rate cuts were passed (from over 20% of GDP in 2000 to 16% of GDP in 2003). By 2005 that trend had reversed and revenue expressed as a percentage of GDP was on its way back up - 17% of GDP in 2005, nearly 18% of GDP in 2006 and 18.3% of GDP in 2007.

Now try and tell me that under a different set of circumstances than the one that was in place a superior outcome would have been realized Dog. Go ahead and tell us how much those tax rate reductions have cost the federal treasury when all of those figures are based on the purely speculative premise that the economy would have expanded as much as it did without the tax rate cuts as it did with them.

Ryan has been compensated for his representation of Wisconsin's 1st Congressional District with monies paid out of the treasury of these United States in accordance with the Article I Section 6 of the Constitution Dog. That compensation is not government assistance. Government assistance is SNAPS, Section 8 housing, Pell Grants for students in families with incomes in excess of $60K a year, insurance premium subsidies for families making 400% of the poverty level - things like that - which does include survivor benefits for minor children under Social Security.

Ironically, thanks to the recent decision of the Supreme Court, Congress will now be able to pass legislation requiring everyone to purchase life insurance policies and disability insurance policies or be taxed for failing to do so in an effort to lower the deficit spending and future unfunded liabilities of the Social Security program and eliminate free riders who fail to provide for their families should they die or become disabled while their families are dependent upon them. If it works for health insurance, it should work elsewhere, right?

Deflecting once again Printsmith? Ryan has achieved his "success" from taxpayer funded assistance. That is the topic of this thread, and spin and deflect as you may try, bottom line, Ryan is a product of government help.