Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

30 Jan 2015 11:21 #51 by PrintSmith
He would be able to decide not to enter into a contract to create a custom cake for them, yes. Would he be able to deny them the ability to buy a cake that had been baked and was on display in the case, no. That is the difference between public accommodation and matters of contract Brandon.

But you have yet to answer the question. Why is building a custom home a matter of contract and baking a custom cake a matter of public accommodation?

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30 Jan 2015 11:27 #52 by Brandon
Disgusting. The rest of us can all be glad that your sick wishes will never become law.
Please refer to my first post in this thread, in which I told you that you weren't entitled to your own facts about the definition of public accommodations in Colorado. Do you understand that?

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30 Jan 2015 11:33 #53 by PrintSmith
Why is building a custom home a matter of contract and the baking of a custom cake a matter of public accommodation?

The reason you won't answer that question is because, logically, there is no difference, both are matters of contract.

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30 Jan 2015 11:40 #54 by Brandon

Brandon wrote:

PrintSmith wrote: There is no difference between mowing a lawn and baking a cake - both are services provided by one person for another person. And that, Dog, is the fact of the matter.


Geek isn't entitled to its own facts.

www.lpdirect.net/casb/crs/24-34-601.html

24-34-601. Discrimination in places of public accommodation - definition.

Statute text

(1) As used in this part 6, "place of public accommodation" means any place of business engaged in any sales to the public and any place offering services, facilities, privileges, advantages, or accommodations to the public, including but not limited to any business offering wholesale or retail sales to the public; any place to eat, drink, sleep, or rest, or any combination thereof; any sporting or recreational area and facility; any public transportation facility; a barber shop, bathhouse, swimming pool, bath, steam or massage parlor, gymnasium, or other establishment conducted to serve the health, appearance, or physical condition of a person; a campsite or trailer camp; a dispensary, clinic, hospital, convalescent home, or other institution for the sick, ailing, aged, or infirm; a mortuary, undertaking parlor, or cemetery; an educational institution; or any public building, park, arena, theater, hall, auditorium, museum, library, exhibit, or public facility of any kind whether indoor or outdoor. "Place of public accommodation" shall not include a church, synagogue, mosque, or other place that is principally used for religious purposes.

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30 Jan 2015 11:46 - 30 Jan 2015 11:55 #55 by PrintSmith
Over the course of our history, there have been many laws passed and upheld by the courts that are contrary to the rights held by the people Brandon.

I am asking you to logically state the difference between the building of a custom home and the baking of a custom cake that explains why one is a matter of contract and one improperly deemed a public accommodation.

The reason you are having such difficulty drawing a logical distinction between the two is there isn't a logical distinction between the two. Both involve using the skills of one to create a unique item for another. Both involve taking raw materials and combining them using the skills of the craftsman to create something which previously didn't exist. That is why both are properly matters of contract and neither are a public accommodation. That the law is being misused to achieve ends desired by some, or even a majority, of the population doesn't alter the fundamental reality that you are confronted with here Brandon.

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30 Jan 2015 11:50 #56 by Brandon

PrintSmith wrote: Over the course of our history, there have been many laws passed and upheld by the courts that are contrary to the rights held by the people Brandon.


As you may realize at some level, although you will never admit it, the arc of history is moving in the opposite direction that you want it to.

PrintSmith wrote: I am asking you to logically state the difference between the building of a custom home and the baking of a custom cake that explains why one is a matter of contract and one improperly deemed a public accommodation.


Not everyone lives in your fantasy world. In reality, as opposed to your fantasy world, how do you think things would work out for a home builder who refuses to build homes for black people?

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30 Jan 2015 11:58 #57 by PrintSmith
You think the civil rights commission would force them to labor to build the home or to cease building any homes? Of course not. The contractor's efforts are matters of contract, as are the baker's when they are asked to bake a custom cake. One may choose to enter into a contract if they desire, but they can't be forced to enter into it.

I'm still waiting for a logical argument that differentiates between the contractor building a custom home and a baker baking a custom cake. Do you have one or not?

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30 Jan 2015 12:23 #58 by Brandon

PrintSmith wrote: You think the civil rights commission would force them to labor to build the home or to cease building any homes? Of course not. The contractor's efforts are matters of contract, as are the baker's when they are asked to bake a custom cake. One may choose to enter into a contract if they desire, but they can't be forced to enter into it.


What would happen is that they'd be sued or fined, hopefully to the point where they went out of business and had less opportunity to spread their diseased beliefs.

PrintSmith wrote: I'm still waiting for a logical argument that differentiates between the contractor building a custom home and a baker baking a custom cake. Do you have one or not?


You've seen the law that defines a public accommodation as a place of business. The fact that you don't like that doesn't make it go away.

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30 Jan 2015 12:34 #59 by PrintSmith
What would happen is nothing because, as noted, the building of a custom home is a matter of contract, not public accommodation.

The contractor gets to decide for whom he will labor, his services to build a custom home are a matter of contract. What materials will be used, when the work will be completed, the exterior color, the color of the roof, the detail on the door and window frames, texture on the walls, what kind of windows will be installed, what kind of doors, carpet, tile, plumbing fixtures, electrical outlets - all described in the contract because his services are contractual. And exactly the same for the custom cake desired. The custom cake is described in the details of the contract between the two parties.

That you refuse to accept the obvious and choose instead to cling to this notion that any person must labor for anyone chosen by the government for special consideration even in violation of their own will is troubling Brandon.

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30 Jan 2015 13:03 #60 by Brandon

PrintSmith wrote: What would happen is nothing because, as noted, the building of a custom home is a matter of contract, not public accommodation.

The contractor gets to decide for whom he will labor, his services to build a custom home are a matter of contract. What materials will be used, when the work will be completed, the exterior color, the color of the roof, the detail on the door and window frames, texture on the walls, what kind of windows will be installed, what kind of doors, carpet, tile, plumbing fixtures, electrical outlets - all described in the contract because his services are contractual. And exactly the same for the custom cake desired. The custom cake is described in the details of the contract between the two parties.


Apparently your fantasy world does not include the Fair Housing Act.

PrintSmith wrote: That you refuse to accept the obvious and choose instead to cling to this notion that any person must labor for anyone chosen by the government for special consideration even in violation of their own will is troubling Brandon.


In reality, someone could restructure their business so that it is not a public accommodation as defined by law.

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