Sam Lucas Told To Evacuate Before Home Caught Fire

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/30 ... etail.html

Big Development.

Sam Lucas Confronted Face-To-Face By Firefighter Who Told Him To Leave

Not sure if I believe this story.

Good information to have. I do tend to believe it because it fits with what I was hearing at the time.

Thanks for posting this!

Here is a second Denver Post Article.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ ... died-lower

I am curious why they were going door to door. Is this normal procedure or did they do it because they knew the system wasn't working. I know they had communication problems but I am wondering if they knew all this at the time.

wow on this last line of the DP article.

The agency said a number of residents refused evacuation orders and some drove through ditches to evade fire vehicles trying to keep people out of the fire's path.

So lets say that InterCanyon FF did meet up with Sam Lucas. What is there to say he wasn't doing exactly that? No smoking gun here. They are not off the hook.

In fact I get pretty pissed that it looks more like the dept. screws up and is now trying to show what a good job they did - not.

Now I freaking understand why people do whatever they please and have so little trust in the Sheriff's and Fire dept.

And you know it would help to know that it is standard policy to not walk the driveway to the house to let people know, like with Appel who received no notice whatsoever and bad info from dispatch. So that tells me not to trust one word out of the fire department or dispatch or the sheriff's dept. Ok now I think I am on board with a lot of other people.

As I have said before, I think that the 'boots on the ground' firefighters did a great job, much exceeding anything that could be expected of them.

IMO, it was obvious, from listening to the communications on the ECFD, NFFD, and I/C frequencies that there were significant problems with the Incident Command. To be blunt, it appeared to be disorganized and dysfunctional. We will have to wait for the results of the various reviews to find out if that impression is correct or not.

I have no clue whether the I/C firefighter mentioned in these reports was following any protocol, or just doing what he thought was best, or if this is an attempt at coverup. I hope that a full After Action Review will expose the true facts.

This is why I feel it is important to discuss the situation here, from all of our different perspectives, and provide that information to the After Action Review team which I understand has been requested to follow the Bass investigation review, so that all of these questions can be considered and answered.

We owe it to those who lost their lives, their property, and their peace of mind to stay on top of this, and make sure that nothing gets shoved under the rug, and that a full and open review is conducted to help ensure that this does not happen again.

Gotta agree with JF on this.
Those guys out there were heroes. No doubt about it.
I personally believe that the serious problems were a little further up the chain of command.

jf1acai wrote: As I have said before, I think that the 'boots on the ground' firefighters did a great job, much exceeding anything that could be expected of them.

IMO, it was obvious, from listening to the communications on the ECFD, NFFD, and I/C frequencies that there were significant problems with the Incident Command. To be blunt, it appeared to be disorganized and dysfunctional. We will have to wait for the results of the various reviews to find out if that impression is correct or not.

I have no clue whether the I/C firefighter mentioned in these reports was following any protocol, or just doing what he thought was best, or if this is an attempt at coverup. I hope that a full After Action Review will expose the true facts.

This is why I feel it is important to discuss the situation here, from all of our different perspectives, and provide that information to the After Action Review team which I understand has been requested to follow the Bass investigation review, so that all of these questions can be considered and answered.

We owe it to those who lost their lives, their property, and their peace of mind to stay on top of this, and make sure that nothing gets shoved under the rug, and that a full and open review is conducted to help ensure that this does not happen again.

I do NOT live in Jeffco, I live in Parkco,which is a VERY rural and POOR county. What is ALARMING to me is this......Jeffco's tax base,
population,budget is HUGE compared to Parkco's.....IF they can 't get it right,be effective with the larger budget,HOW would my
country (Parkco) compare in an emergency (in TODAYS' financial constraints).

The ABSOLUTE first question to those who are asking for input..........WHY ARE INTERDEPT. CRITICAL COMMUNICATIONS not in place?
12 YEARS of time has lapsed since 9/11/2001.......and the issue has NOT been resolved or addressed. (I understand the mountain
terrain is a HUGE factor,but it is NOT an excuse.)

SECOND, WHY were the maps,schematics of the mountain so terrible OUTDATED? If you are operating from and SOURCING your
actions from OUTDATED information,then the end result can ONLY BE INEFFECTIVE in it's outcome.......

The WHOLE of this sad saga requires a TOTAL and complete overhaul of procedures,and REPERCUSSIONS for the lack of leadership
and ineffective processes....JMO(once again, I will state......NO ONE comes out smelling like a rose,EXCEPT those individuals that put
themselves at death's door to save another.)

mtntrekker wrote: So lets say that InterCanyon FF did meet up with Sam Lucas. What is there to say he wasn't doing exactly that? No smoking gun here. They are not off the hook.

In fact I get pretty pissed that it looks more like the dept. screws up and is now trying to show what a good job they did - not.

Now I freaking understand why people do whatever they please and have so little trust in the Sheriff's and Fire dept.

And you know it would help to know that it is standard policy to not walk the driveway to the house to let people know, like with Appel who received no notice whatsoever and bad info from dispatch. So that tells me not to trust one word out of the fire department or dispatch or the sheriff's dept. Ok now I think I am on board with a lot of other people.

I'm sorry, but when fire is bearing down (as is obvious in the video poster earlier), you don't stay around and go back in to get more stuff. You leave....immediately. You don't wait for the govt or fire dept to tell you to do so.

I tend to believe Inter Canyon because I know many of the guys in that dept. They are awesome, and go way beyond the call of duty. I really don't expect a fireman to wait around. They gotta get to others.

I also don't expect a fireman to walk a driveway because the owner decides they need a chain across the drive. This is common knowledge up here. The govt doesn't need to come and tell you what to do. If you are curious, ask the dept. When I moved up here, I spoke to the fire dept about their recommendations...One was-Don't block your driveway, and in fact, make sure you maintain it so their trucks can get down it, because that risks the fire personel's life. If the fire is bearing down, seconds matter....in the time they could walk the driveway, they could warn another few homes.

I agree communication needs to be better. Stop blaming and start learning. This was a tragedy, but it is done. Lets learn how to avoid this in the future if at all possible, but really. We are lucky to have such wonderful people who put their lives at risk so we can live in this beautiful place. Take some personal responsibility that you should have when you move into a tinder box. If you see fire, or see smoke, LEAVE. Don't wait for someone to tell you to do so! :bash