Biden is NOT the One.

05 Apr 2020 19:25 #41 by ramage
Replied by ramage on topic Biden is NOT the One.
Deflection is not your strong suit.
Please enumerate the falsities that President Trump has told the public.
Did you deign to watch Biden hypocritical statements?
By the way, it is Covid-19. (which stands for corona virus disease 2019.)

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06 Apr 2020 07:56 - 06 Apr 2020 07:57 #42 by koobookie
Replied by koobookie on topic Biden is NOT the One.

President Donald Trump began March with a barrage of false claims about the coronavirus pandemic -- understating the extent of the crisis, overstating the availability of tests, inaccurately blaming his predecessor and wrongly insisting that the crisis was unforeseen.
Trump made 50 false claims from March 2 through March 8, then 21 false claims from March 9 through March 15. Of those 71 false claims, 33 were related to the coronavirus. That is on top of some additional misleading claims from Trump about the coronavirus (we only count the false claims here), plus some false and misleading claims from members of his administration.
Trump is now averaging about 57 false claims per week since we started counting at CNN on July 8, 2019. From that date through March 15, he has made 2,062 false claims in all.

www.cnn.com/2020/03/22/politics/fact-che...ims-march/index.html

The global outbreak of the novel coronavirus has confronted President Trump with a public health and economic crisis that requires consistent, accurate messaging to guide Americans. But the president often has played down the threats, offering false, misleading or ignorant statements.

We have fact-checked many of these claims and recorded them in our database of all of Trump’s claims. But now we are starting a page to list the most notable coronavirus statements in one place, in chronological order. We intend to keep updating this page as the crisis unfolds.

www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/03/...-coronavirus-claims/

Here’s what the president said in public remarks, interviews and tweets from Jan. 22 to March 10 -– one day before the World Health Organization declared the global outbreak a pandemic.

www.factcheck.org/2020/03/trumps-stateme...out-the-coronavirus/

Sorry, I guess I should start calling it "The Trump Virus" instead of Covid-45?

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06 Apr 2020 08:56 #43 by ramage
Replied by ramage on topic Biden is NOT the One.
What CNN and factcheck call false statements, I consider optimistic statements made with the information supplied.
I have to wonder what basis was used to call their citations false. For example, from the factcheck.org citation:
March 9: “So last year 37,000 Americans died from the common Flu. It averages between 27,000 and 70,000 per year. Nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on. At this moment there are 546 confirmed cases of CoronaVirus, with 22 deaths. Think about that!” — Trump in a tweet.

If Biden is elected I will move to New Zealand, taking James Comey's place in line at immigration.

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06 Apr 2020 09:04 #44 by koobookie
Replied by koobookie on topic Biden is NOT the One.

ramage wrote: What CNN and factcheck call false statements, I consider optimistic statements made with the information supplied.
I have to wonder what basis was used to call their citations false. For example, from the factcheck.org citation:
March 9: “So last year 37,000 Americans died from the common Flu. It averages between 27,000 and 70,000 per year. Nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on. At this moment there are 546 confirmed cases of CoronaVirus, with 22 deaths. Think about that!” — Trump in a tweet.

If Biden is elected I will move to New Zealand, taking James Comey's place in line at immigration.


Optimistic? I expect my leadership in this country to tell me facts, not rosy made up stories of how he wants it to look. I expect our leadership to shoot straight, not pretend it's nothing. His inaction on the Trump Virus is costing lives.

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06 Apr 2020 10:09 - 06 Apr 2020 10:11 #45 by Rick
Replied by Rick on topic Biden is NOT the One.

koobookie wrote: Optimistic? I expect my leadership in this country to tell me facts, not rosy made up stories of how he wants it to look. I expect our leadership to shoot straight, not pretend it's nothing. His inaction on the Trump Virus is costing lives.

The negativity in the media is as prevalent as their non stop 24/7 attempts to take out Trump in any way possible. The fact that the president is trying to bring some optimism to a nation that is terrified of their collective futures is something we should be thankful for. You will never find anything good to say about any of his decisions because you would never admit that he was right about anything. Do you think his early travel ban from China was helpful in reducing the spread here? When the governors of NY and CA gave Trump good marks for his response to this did you think they were lying?

If you and other Monday morning quarterbacks have some kind of honest scenario that would have been implemented from another "better" leader, I'd love to hear it and discuss those details. This kind of thing has never happened at this scale before and I think if you look back at how Obama handled H1N1, I don't think you can honestly say he would have handled covid19 any better than Trump, especially if he thought banning travel from China would be seen as zenophobic, which he probably would.

It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies and nosers−out of unorthodoxy

George Orwell

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06 Apr 2020 10:23 #46 by koobookie
Replied by koobookie on topic Biden is NOT the One.

Rick wrote:

koobookie wrote: Optimistic? I expect my leadership in this country to tell me facts, not rosy made up stories of how he wants it to look. I expect our leadership to shoot straight, not pretend it's nothing. His inaction on the Trump Virus is costing lives.

The negativity in the media is as prevalent as their non stop 24/7 attempts to take out Trump in any way possible. The fact that the president is trying to bring some optimism to a nation that is terrified of their collective futures is something we should be thankful for. You will never find anything good to say about any of his decisions because you would never admit that he was right about anything. Do you think his early travel ban from China was helpful in reducing the spread here? When the governors of NY and CA gave Trump good marks for his response to this did you think they were lying?

If you and other Monday morning quarterbacks have some kind of honest scenario that would have been implemented from another "better" leader, I'd love to hear it and discuss those details. This kind of thing has never happened at this scale before and I think if you look back at how Obama handled H1N1, I don't think you can honestly say he would have handled covid19 any better than Trump, especially if he thought banning travel from China would be seen as zenophobic, which he probably would.


An absolutely wonderful deflection, Rick! Good job!

If you took your car in for work at a mechanic, and they told you it was just a scratch and an oil change and your car would be good as new, that would be great, right? But then he calls you a few days later and tells you that you need new tires. Okay, so why didn't he tell you that before? Then a few days later, you need a new radiator, as there was a puddle under car when he moved it. Then he calls and says the axels are shot, and you need them replaced.

I would rather have truth and facts given to me, so that I can make decisions based upon those facts, rather than have a rosy picture given to me. That's what Trump has been doing. Are you honestly okay with him not telling the truth?

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06 Apr 2020 11:29 - 06 Apr 2020 11:31 #47 by Rick
Replied by Rick on topic Biden is NOT the One.

koobookie wrote:

Rick wrote:

koobookie wrote: Optimistic? I expect my leadership in this country to tell me facts, not rosy made up stories of how he wants it to look. I expect our leadership to shoot straight, not pretend it's nothing. His inaction on the Trump Virus is costing lives.

The negativity in the media is as prevalent as their non stop 24/7 attempts to take out Trump in any way possible. The fact that the president is trying to bring some optimism to a nation that is terrified of their collective futures is something we should be thankful for. You will never find anything good to say about any of his decisions because you would never admit that he was right about anything. Do you think his early travel ban from China was helpful in reducing the spread here? When the governors of NY and CA gave Trump good marks for his response to this did you think they were lying?

If you and other Monday morning quarterbacks have some kind of honest scenario that would have been implemented from another "better" leader, I'd love to hear it and discuss those details. This kind of thing has never happened at this scale before and I think if you look back at how Obama handled H1N1, I don't think you can honestly say he would have handled covid19 any better than Trump, especially if he thought banning travel from China would be seen as zenophobic, which he probably would.


An absolutely wonderful deflection, Rick! Good job!

If you took your car in for work at a mechanic, and they told you it was just a scratch and an oil change and your car would be good as new, that would be great, right? But then he calls you a few days later and tells you that you need new tires. Okay, so why didn't he tell you that before? Then a few days later, you need a new radiator, as there was a puddle under car when he moved it. Then he calls and says the axels are shot, and you need them replaced.

I would rather have truth and facts given to me, so that I can make decisions based upon those facts, rather than have a rosy picture given to me. That's what Trump has been doing. Are you honestly okay with him not telling the truth?

First of all, that's a reeeaalllyyy bad analogy, and I am a mechanic so I'll give you my perspective.

In one situation we have a car going in for an inspection where the vast majority of issues can be diagnosed visually and with diagnostic equipment that reads data from the vehicles many computer modules. I can also get a lot of information from driving the vehicle and feeling/listening to things that don't feel right. I can give a list of issues that I can identify 100% and I can give a list of things that need to be investigated deeper... those investigations would cost more and I would have to give the customer an idea of how optimistic I am about whether or not the more expensive inspection is worth doing based on my knowledge.

In the case of this global pandemic, especially early on, there are no answers. Even the experts can't say what will fix this or how long it will last, they can only give us guesses about their best and worse case scenarios. Every leader on this planet is handling this crisis in a different way but nobody can know the absolute right way to "fix' it when nobody has been in this situation before. If you think Trump is like the mechanic that can give you the answers you want, he can't, nor can all the experts that surround him. But he can give us some hope that the world is not going to end and that our country will come back from this. If he was to take the gloom and doom approach without offering hope and optimism, the facts of human nature would make this problem much much worse. If you think hoarding is bad now, just think what it would be like if we collectively had less hope for this to end without a complete societal meltdown. There is no 100% accuracy coming out of the mouths of the experts, only educated guesses. Leadership in times of crisis is more about lifting the spirits of those who are scared than it is about being 100% accurate about how the problem will be fixed and how long it will last, especially when the experts are all guessing anyway. If Obama was in charge and was being the optimist and offering his HOPE and change, I think your criticism would not be present, even if what he was telling you was not 100% accurate. Remember what Obama told us about the ACA and how it was going to make healthcare so much better and cheaper... all so he could push it down our collective throats? Was it better, was it cheaper, does it matter?

It was always the women, and above all the young ones, who were the most bigoted adherents of the Party, the swallowers of slogans, the amateur spies and nosers−out of unorthodoxy

George Orwell

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06 Apr 2020 11:42 #48 by koobookie
Replied by koobookie on topic Biden is NOT the One.
Trump receives daily briefings on this situation. I am certain he knew about this in December and was told the severity of the virus. I'm sure he knew the seriousness - he has the entire US government intelligence at his disposal. He had to have known what was coming, yet he downplayed the situation to the public. To call his statements in February and March "optimistic" requires a suspension of rational thinking.

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06 Apr 2020 11:51 #49 by koobookie
Replied by koobookie on topic Biden is NOT the One.
Rick, the mechanic analogy is still pertinent. I don't know you, but you're probably an honest guy, an honest mechanic. You will find all the things wrong with a car and report that to the owner prior to starting on the repairs.

Trump is not an honest man. That is widely known. He has defrauded hundreds, if not thousands, of people during his business dealings. He is not a trustworthy man. If he were a car mechanic, he would not tell the car owner about all the things wrong until he had started working. He wold probably make up a rosy picture, telling them not to worry about that shimmy, that scraping noise. "It will get better by itself when the weather gets warmer."

The point is, he misled the American public on several issues concerning this virus. People look to their leaders to tell them the truth, to give them straight facts. Trump did not do that.

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06 Apr 2020 14:12 - 06 Apr 2020 14:14 #50 by FredHayek
Replied by FredHayek on topic Biden is NOT the One.

koobookie wrote: Trump receives daily briefings on this situation. I am certain he knew about this in December and was told the severity of the virus. I'm sure he knew the seriousness - he has the entire US government intelligence at his disposal. He had to have known what was coming, yet he downplayed the situation to the public. To call his statements in February and March "optimistic" requires a suspension of rational thinking.


I don't see how he could know about the severity of the virus. Even the Chinese government was misled by their underlings. WHO was saying as late as January that it couldn't jump person to person. Every year the CDC makes up a influenza cocktail of which strains they think will hit America hard this year from Asia. And often they get it wrong, so the vaccine is only 60% effective. Even now we don't know how severe the virus will be, 100K? Which is just a very bad flu season.
If you check back, we had some pretty nasty flu seasons in the late 50's and late 60's. Over 100,000 dead in the 50's over one Winter when the population was half what it is now.

Are you still certain the US government knew all the details? That our intelligence was better than Beijing's?
Maybe you just want to rub Trump's nose in it? President Obama was very late to take action on the H1N1 epidemic that happened in his administration. The press didn't roast him alive. Partisanship at work?

Thomas Sowell: There are no solutions, just trade-offs.

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