Just so you all know

Nmysys wrote: SC:

I said maybe an apology was in order because he showed that there were two sides to the coin, or story. He shouldn't be attacked for having posted an alternative theory if for no reason at all but to give you a different opinion on the subject. Maybe it will get you to do more research, maybe not. That is up to you. I do commend him for his research.

One thing I do know is that when I was young, before they came up with this diagnosis, we also had children who showed these exact same symptoms. Other methods were used. I happen to have a life long friend who would have been diagnosed with ADHD had it been known then as a disease. Today he is a scientist just like you are SC, only his life is very much different than it might have been if he had been raised on Ritalin. Other than that, I do not have a dog in this fight. I felt when I read the thread earlier, that MB had shown a totally different perspective that might have had some merit if you didn't think he was putting you down, though that was a natural response from any mother.

What your friend's life would have been like if he had been exposed to Ritalin is pure speculation. It may or may not have been different.

MB's research is not primary research. Al he is doing is citing references and jumping to conclusions without critical analysis of the sources.

major bean wrote: Good parenting includes protecting your child from social scrutiny. A parent should never voluntarily say publicly or privately that their child has a personality, character, or mental problem.

This is not in the best interest of the child and it may follow him/her for the rest of life, in commerce, with the government, and in relationship with civil liberties. Certain things should be kept private.

There are lots of things parents do that impact the child for the rest of their lives. Simply telling them to be seen not heard at the dinner table can leave a child hesitant to speak up because they learned early on their opinions were unimportant. That is just one of many such examples. There is no right way to parent only different ways. You have done your job in a way that seemingly produced good results, others who have followed alternative pathways can be equally proud of what they accomplished with their children. Recall the saying about kids growing up well despite of their parents? There is truth in that. I know I was not perfect in how I parented, am still learning, but I've got two terrific boys of whom I am proud. Perhaps it was all their mother's doing and I had no influence? It's best to give some credit and leeway on parenting issues as you are not omniscient, but just another parent doing the best they can.

Wow, there sure seem to be a lot of amazing fathers on here. It's a wonder kids turned out ok. I'm sure the kid or the mothers had little to do with it. Incredible! The ego of some amazes me beyond belief!

Sunshine Girl wrote: Wow, there sure seem to be a lot of amazing fathers on here. It's a wonder kids turned out ok. I'm sure the kid or the mothers had little to do with it. Incredible! The ego of some amazes me beyond belief!

Your missing the point. No one said that the fathers are the only parent. You chose to make that conclusion that mothers had little to do with it. Incredible indeed.

No it's the fathers that brag about how amazing their kids are not the mothers who actually raised their kids. Incredible!

Sunshine Girl wrote: No it's the fathers that brag about how amazing their kids are not the mothers who actually raised their kids. Incredible!

So you are telling me it is wrong to be proud of your children and that mothers are the only ones who influence a child during the formative years of birth to 5 years of age? Those early years are when much of a child's personality are formed by observing their parents.

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

Sunshine Girl wrote: No it's the fathers that brag about how amazing their kids are not the mothers who actually raised their kids. Incredible!

So you are telling me it is wrong to be proud of your children and that mothers are the only ones who influence a child during the formative years of birth to 5 years of age? Those early years are when much of a child's personality are formed by observing their parents.

Kinda have to call BS on that one. There is a big difference about being in the picture for a few years of a kids early life and being there day in and day out not only during a few early years, but being the parent who is really doing the raising and molding of that child EVERY DAY until they move out. I watched my ex-husband bragging about our kids THAT I RAISED and that he had very little to do with. I can't stand it when men do that and I see it when it does happen. Trust me, it is not the absentee parent that deserves anything more than a very little bit of the credit. I think the moms (or step-parents) that actually did the work and the kids would be the first to say, "Dude, it's not because of you so much I turned out to be a good adult." But hey, if the men need to think it's them go ahead. It's a bit delusional to me though. Yes, it's great to be proud of your child! I just wish those that had little to do with it could give credit where credit is due AND it's not because of them so much.

Sunshine Girl wrote:

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

Sunshine Girl wrote: No it's the fathers that brag about how amazing their kids are not the mothers who actually raised their kids. Incredible!

So you are telling me it is wrong to be proud of your children and that mothers are the only ones who influence a child during the formative years of birth to 5 years of age? Those early years are when much of a child's personality are formed by observing their parents.

Kinda have to call BS on that one. There is a big difference about being in the pictures for a few years of a kids early life and being there day in and day out not only during a few early years, but being the parent who is really doing the raising and molding of that child EVERY DAY until they move out. I watched my ex-husband bragging about our kids THAT I RAISED and that he had very little to do with. I can't stand it when men do that and I see it when it does. Trust me, it is not the absentee parent that deserves anything more than a very little bit of the credit. I think the moms that actually did the work and the kids would be the first to say, "Dude, it's not because of you so much I turned out to be a good adult." But hey, if the men need to think it's them go ahead. It's a bit delusional to me though. Yes, it's great to be proud of your child! I just wish those that had little to do with it could give credit where credit is due AND it's not because of them so much.

You can call BS all you want. Were talking about the formative years that according to child psychology studies encompass the first 5 years of life. This is not to say that additional learning and shaping does not take place subsequently. And let's face it, a child's development even during the formative years and thereafter receive input from all of their surroundings, not just the mother. TV, teachers, friends, etc. all contribute to the personal tapestry that defines a child.

So you watched your ex brag about your kids. Is it wrong for him to be proud of them? You assume that he takes all the credit for who they are, just like you assumed that I was taking all the credit for my two boys. Personally, the only important thing is that they have turned out well, regardless of who had the major influence and played the major role but then that is not an issue for me like it is for you. You as a mother, like my mother can take all the credit for the formative years development of their children since you were the only parent around. But I'll also admit, that my dad did have an influence on me later in life, even if he was there for only a shot period of time.

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

major bean wrote: Good parenting includes protecting your child from social scrutiny. A parent should never voluntarily say publicly or privately that their child has a personality, character, or mental problem.

This is not in the best interest of the child and it may follow him/her for the rest of life, in commerce, with the government, and in relationship with civil liberties. Certain things should be kept private.

There are lots of things parents do that impact the child for the rest of their lives. Simply telling them to be seen not heard at the dinner table can leave a child hesitant to speak up because they learned early on their opinions were unimportant. That is just one of many such examples. There is no right way to parent only different ways. You have done your job in a way that seemingly produced good results, others who have followed alternative pathways can be equally proud of what they accomplished with their children. Recall the asying about kids growing up well despite of their parents? There is truth in that. I know I was not perfect in how I parented, am still learning, but I've got two terrific boys of whom I am proud. Perhaps it was all their mother's doing and I had no influence? It's best to give some credit and leeway on parenting issues as you are not omniscient, but just another parent doing the best they can.

I'm sure you had a role in their early years before they were in Kindergarten. Your statement/question: "Perhaps it was all their mother's doing and I had no influence?" The answer to your question is: "Yes, for the most part."

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

Sunshine Girl wrote:

Rockdoc Franz wrote:

Sunshine Girl wrote: No it's the fathers that brag about how amazing their kids are not the mothers who actually raised their kids. Incredible!

So you are telling me it is wrong to be proud of your children and that mothers are the only ones who influence a child during the formative years of birth to 5 years of age? Those early years are when much of a child's personality are formed by observing their parents.

Kinda have to call BS on that one. There is a big difference about being in the pictures for a few years of a kids early life and being there day in and day out not only during a few early years, but being the parent who is really doing the raising and molding of that child EVERY DAY until they move out. I watched my ex-husband bragging about our kids THAT I RAISED and that he had very little to do with. I can't stand it when men do that and I see it when it does. Trust me, it is not the absentee parent that deserves anything more than a very little bit of the credit. I think the moms that actually did the work and the kids would be the first to say, "Dude, it's not because of you so much I turned out to be a good adult." But hey, if the men need to think it's them go ahead. It's a bit delusional to me though. Yes, it's great to be proud of your child! I just wish those that had little to do with it could give credit where credit is due AND it's not because of them so much.

You can call BS all you want. Were talking about the formative years that according to child psychology studies encompass the first 5 years of life. This is not to say that additional learning and shaping does not take place subsequently. And let's face it, a child's development even during the formative years and thereafter receive input from all of their surroundings, not just the mother. TV, teachers, friends, etc. all contribute to the personal tapestry that defines a child.

So you watched your ex brag about your kids. Is it wrong for him to be proud of them? You assume that he takes all the credit for who they are, just like you assumed that I was taking all the credit for my two boys. Personally, the only important thing is that they have turned out well, regardless of who had the major influence and played the major role but then that is not an issue for me like it is for you. You as a mother, like my mother can take all the credit for the formative years development of their children since you were the only parent around. But I'll also admit, that my dad did have an influence on me later in life, even if he was there for only a shot period of time.

It's not just my ex that I see do it. I'm glad he is proud of the kids. I didn't "assume" anything though. Many teachers and caregivers had equal influence to some roles that absentee parents have had in their kids lives. This during there formative years. Let's be fair and give them credit as well because I'm sure they deserve it. I see this kind of chest thumping all to often and I can't stand it. As I said before.....it's delusional. And as I've said before.....I'm sure those kids and moms would agree. But hey, people can believe whatever makes them feel better. It's just BS - and I feel completely comfortable standing by that statement. Just a thought to some of those "look at me parents" - - sometimes your kids turn out well in spite your relationship with them. Before people on here congratulate themselves too much we might just want to give an ounce of credit to the child themselves. Perish the thought! LOL