archer wrote: Sorry rick those are excuses not reasons. The GOP made itself perfectly clear, they had one goal and only one goal, make Obama a one term president. They had no interest in participating. You can spin history however you want, but it doesnt change the truth.
You guys always say that like it's something unique to the GOP. If you don't think the Dems didn't do everything they could to make Bush a one term president, then I think you are very naive. Congressmen Price and Ryan both had plans back in 2009 but YOUR media probably didn't fill you in on those details.
Obama promised this law would be created in an open and transparent way which was a straight up lie. There were bribes made to get the last couple votes needed and none of the Republican ideas, like selling across state lines or tort reform, were even entertained. There has also been an idea of healthcare savings plans which were also brushed off. NOTHING in the ACA addresses the real cost of health insurance... the cost of medical care, medical supplies/devices, drugs, etc.
Don't we already have HSAs? Haven't the Republicans historically been against interfering with the states rights on selling insurance across state lines? Don't get the idea I'm happy with this law, I'm not, nor do I like the Part D from the Republicans. We are best known for doing half assed laws because the 2 parties can't agree on anything..... My hope is that everyone becomes so fed up with trying to fix the messes both parties have inflicted on our already broken health care system that single payer becomes the only option.
I guess being lied to isn't a big deal for those on the left.
I can explain it to you but I can't understand it for you.
"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the Government take care of him; better take a closer look at the American Indian." - Henry Ford
Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges; When the Republic is at its most corrupt the laws are most numerous. - Publius Cornelius Tacitus
I agree with homeagain: healthcare was horribly broken the way it was being run and the changes required to fix it will require a lot of time, effort, and money. It's not an easy or quick fix, but something had to be done. Nothing that was passed was going to be perfect - too many cooks in the kitchen - but the only way to fix a problem is to work through it.
"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill
I'll be the first one to step forward and say that the cost of healthcare is out of control; Obamacare is not the solution to the problem. Making Government bigger and increasing taxes on everyone who is still working for a living only feeds the bloated pig that is our current form of Government. Worse, Obamacare provides coverage for most, assuming they can afford the increased premiums, while giving lower quality healthcare at a higher price. Have a look at the United Kingdom and the commonwealth if you need a reference.
Best of all, you'll have the IRS looking up your hind end every April to ensure that you signed up or paid the penalty. If taking care of myself is my own responsibility then why in the world would I welcome the IRS invading my privacy and forcing me to either pay more for healthcare or pay their penalty?!
Worst of all, Barry is changing the law every time this turd runs into a "complication" that should have been the end of the law or at least sent it back to Congress for a re-write. Last time I checked the Executive branch doesn't write and change laws, that's the Legislative branch's job, and defaulting controversial bills to the Judicial branch is nothing more than shopping for answers when the Executive branch can't get the Legislative branch to do it's job.
What hasn't been happening is cooperation between members on both sides of the isle. If no one is willing to negotiate this is what happens, Barry has the trump card, if he doesn't like an issue or bill he'll issue an executive order and ignore the legal process instead of working with Congress.
Maybe in 2014 and 2016 voters will come out of their comas and rethink what they did to themselves after suffering ever increasing taxes, decreasing services, and an an economy that is in a permanent nose dive.
I can explain it to you but I can't understand it for you.
"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the Government take care of him; better take a closer look at the American Indian." - Henry Ford
Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges; When the Republic is at its most corrupt the laws are most numerous. - Publius Cornelius Tacitus
Science Chic wrote: I agree with homeagain: healthcare was horribly broken the way it was being run and the changes required to fix it will require a lot of time, effort, and money. It's not an easy or quick fix, but something had to be done. Nothing that was passed was going to be perfect - too many cooks in the kitchen - but the only way to fix a problem is to work through it.
A few regulations could have been passed into law such as pre-existing condition regs. This behemoth will never work. Period. Bet I can keep that promise better than our president.
archer wrote: My hope is that everyone becomes so fed up with trying to fix the messes both parties have inflicted on our already broken health care system that single payer becomes the only option.
I agree except I'd prefer the American people are ALLOWED to KEEP their own choices and salvage a little lost liberty. It would be much simpler to just expand Medicare (that's supposedly so good) for the poor and put a progressive tax on current policies to pay for it. Someone who can afford insurance but doesn't have a bunch of extra liquid assets wouldn't be taxed much while those who barely notice the cost would pay more. Why would that not work?
The left is angry because they are now being judged by the content of their character and not by the color of their skin.
Science Chic wrote: I agree with homeagain: healthcare was horribly broken the way it was being run and the changes required to fix it will require a lot of time, effort, and money. It's not an easy or quick fix, but something had to be done. Nothing that was passed was going to be perfect - too many cooks in the kitchen - but the only way to fix a problem is to work through it.
A few regulations could have been passed into law such as pre-existing condition regs. This behemoth will never work. Period. Bet I can keep that promise better than our president.
I think I have to disagree TM. Based on what my friend wrote about the history of healthcare from her 30 year first-hand perspective, it seems like that's what had been done (patchwork fixes) and each time various groups found ways to twist it to their advantage and make the system as a whole more broken. I think something comprehensive had to be passed and then tweaked as necessary afterwards. No, I'm not saying that the ACA was perfect, but I think it was the way it had to be done or else we'd have been continuing band-aid measures that could be exploited.
http://mymountaintown.com/forums/the-courthouse/29815
"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill
That's what happens when the lobbies write the legislation. They write loophole into it. I really think this will destroy the economy the way that it is written. It already keeps young people, under 26, from getting married or they have to pay through the nose to get insurance. It leaves young people a very cheap opt out on the insurance that they cannot afford. The penalty is only $90 or 1%. The system is set up to fail and take insurance companies out with it. It was a lying, underhanded way to force the country into something that very few wanted - single payer, government controlled healthcare. They cited the stats on how "bad" our healthcare system was by comparison. If they had used the same measuring stick, we would have easily been the best in the world, but they used statistical tricks such as comparing our statistics to countries that use different measurements such as the way infant mortality is calculated. What they have done is taken a mostly working system with some problems and turned it into a mostly problem system that sometimes works. Great job democrats...
towermonkey wrote: That's what happens when the lobbies write the legislation. They write loophole into it. I really think this will destroy the economy the way that it is written. It already keeps young people, under 26, from getting married or they have to pay through the nose to get insurance. It leaves young people a very cheap opt out on the insurance that they cannot afford. The penalty is only $90 or 1%. The system is set up to fail and take insurance companies out with it. It was a lying, underhanded way to force the country into something that very few wanted - single payer, government controlled healthcare. They cited the stats on how "bad" our healthcare system was by comparison. If they had used the same measuring stick, we would have easily been the best in the world, but they used statistical tricks such as comparing our statistics to countries that use different measurements such as the way infant mortality is calculated. What they have done is taken a mostly working system with some problems and turned it into a mostly problem system that sometimes works. Great job democrats...
They also did nothing to address medical costs. This was about wealth redistribution without much concern for the core problem of increasing costs.
The left is angry because they are now being judged by the content of their character and not by the color of their skin.
Science Chic wrote: I think something comprehensive had to be passed and then tweaked as necessary afterwards. No, I'm not saying that the ACA was perfect, but I think it was the way it had to be done or else we'd have been continuing band-aid measures that could be exploited.
http://mymountaintown.com/forums/the-courthouse/29815
You're suggesting that passing poorly written, over-reaching, unread legislation that impacts millions of people and creates confusion and waste is what had to happen to address health care? Turn something into a complete fustercluck and then try to tweak it? If that's now the approach to reaching a solution in this country then we are truly screwed.
No, SC. 0, Reid and the far left socialists wanted and still want complete government control of health care. If you don't understand that you haven't been paying attention.
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D., Nev.) was asked whether his goal was to move Obamacare to a single-payer system. His answer? “Yes, yes. Absolutely, yes.”
Don't forget SC - This mess is 100% Democrat legislation. Democrat House, Senate, and Presidency passed this without reading it. No Republicans voted for it.
