Democrats vote to raise ALL of our taxes......

The middle class has always driven the economy, as have small businesses.....not by directly creating jobs but by being consumers....the middle class buys......this increases inventories and sales, that increases purchases of manufactured goods....all those businesses in between the manufacturer and the consumer make more money, hire more people. Small businesses, whether they hire more people or not.....also buy goods, especially startups....again that is good for the economy and good for jobs on down the line. Of the people i know who have started small businesses, they were solidly middle class, not wealthy. They pour their heart and sole and their SBA loans into making a go of it....they have suppliers who are happy to have their business and those suppliers create jobs. It is how our economy has always been driven......by consumers.

Regardless of the above spins...the DemonCrats, et al, will have their chance to do whatever with this issue after the elections...They won't be fired the next day...their days will be numbered, but they as well as the other morons will have some time left. But, it really doesn't do them any good campaigning wise to have let this happen in view of the Viking's post above...^ Speaking of shooting themselves in the feet, I'm surprised they're not all rolling around on dollies by now...

Spykster wrote: Regardless of the above spins...the DemonCrats, et al, will have their chance to do whatever with this issue after the elections...They won't be fired the next day...their days will be numbered, but they as well as the other morons will have some time left. But, it really doesn't do them any good campaigning wise to have let this happen in view of the Viking's post above...^ Speaking of shooting themselves in the feet, I'm surprised they're not all rolling around on dollies by now...

As a life long bureaucrat, your own admission, cop fireman,gov. pension recipient, you know little about what motivates entrepreneurs. We started a business in tough times knowing that if we were lucky and smart enough to be successful we would be taxed a little more and it never once came into the discussion on whether or not to start this business.. Entrepreneurs look for opportunity and could care less about tax rates. Learn a little history. Motive is all about need and the ability to fill it. I have been a self employed entrepreneur my entire life and the politics of taxes never made a significant influence on my decisions. Lazy wanna be's think they know what moves people but you are so wrong. I was in business during Reagan then Clinton and the tax policies never entered the equation. Job creators could care less about marginal tax rates, total myth. Been there unlike most of you arm chair "job creators".

I understand exactly what you are saying....After years of working for others, I struck out on my own and built a nice business that supported myself and my daughter, and allowed me to retire comfortably. Tax rates were never a consideration when I started the business, nor at any time after. Truth be told, if I had been netting over $250,000 I would have been quite happy to pay the extra tax on the income over that threshold. Very few small businesses ever make that kind of income.....we are talking net income to be taxed, not gross. The problem as I see it is the right is concentrating on the poor schmuck who makes $251,000 and will have to pay and extra 3% or so on that $1000. I doubt it will sink his business or cause him to close it down. I am more concerned with the people who make a million or more and have been getting the tax breaks for years.....why? because they contribute to political campaigns....and this is, after all, politics.....pure and simple. The right rewards those who keep them in power, and punishes the little guy who has no power.....other than his vote. I do believe after the Republicans get into power......they will again be seen for the elitists they are, and the pendulum will swing once again. It always does.

JMC wrote:

Spykster wrote: Regardless of the above spins...the DemonCrats, et al, will have their chance to do whatever with this issue after the elections...They won't be fired the next day...their days will be numbered, but they as well as the other morons will have some time left. But, it really doesn't do them any good campaigning wise to have let this happen in view of the Viking's post above...^ Speaking of shooting themselves in the feet, I'm surprised they're not all rolling around on dollies by now...

As a life long bureaucrat, your own admission, cop fireman,gov. pension recipient, you know little about what motivates entrepreneurs. We started a business in tough times knowing that if we were lucky and smart enough to be successful we would be taxed a little more and it never once came into the discussion on whether or not to start this business.. Entrepreneurs look for opportunity and could care less about tax rates. Learn a little history. Motive is all about need and the ability to fill it. I have been a self employed entrepreneur my entire life and the politics of taxes never made a significant influence on my decisions. Lazy wanna be's think they know what moves people but you are so wrong. I was in business during Reagan then Clinton and the tax policies never entered the equation. Job creators could care less about marginal tax rates, total myth. Been there unlike most of you arm chair "job creators".

Interesting...Life long bureaucrat by my own admission? NO!!! In both the PD and FD I was in the trenches risking my life every day. As an Officer in the FDNY, there was administrative work, but I was still in the field risking my life every day. Bureaucratic? HARDLY. My pension is from NY State, and the combined worth of the five major Public Safety/Service systems, is over 100 Billion dollars. IT is administered by Bureaucrats, and competently so, unlike California and Colorado. I paid a large percentage of my pay towards my pension. So stop trying to make it look like I'm an over the hill pencil pusher on the public dole, because it just isn't so. You call me a lazy wannabe? What do I wannabe - you ? NO !!! Am I an arm chair "job creator" NO !!! I also was a successful business owner in a real tough place to make a living - NYC, while in the FDNY. Siding and windows, and a car service. I did p.d. well. I seriously doubt if you ever could perform at the standards to which I was held, then or now. I have cousins that are currently business owners, and your line of thought is so far out in left field, you are on the outside of the fence. They are very concerned about everything from the tax issues to the true cost of MessiahMed. I don't know where you own your business, but it doesn't seem like it's on this planet. What I read in you snitty little unprovoked little diatribe against me is a healthy dose of jealousy, coupled with not a whole lot of sensibility, with a hearty dose of plain old ignorance. You ought to know what is dribbling out of that hole under your nose before it starts to dribble out. P.S. Lazy ? NO !!! I have done and continue to do various volunteer gigs. Money isn't everything, and besides, I have enough for what ever it is I want to do ( probably unlike yourself).

Spykster wrote:

JMC wrote:

Spykster wrote: Regardless of the above spins...the DemonCrats, et al, will have their chance to do whatever with this issue after the elections...They won't be fired the next day...their days will be numbered, but they as well as the other morons will have some time left. But, it really doesn't do them any good campaigning wise to have let this happen in view of the Viking's post above...^ Speaking of shooting themselves in the feet, I'm surprised they're not all rolling around on dollies by now...

As a life long bureaucrat, your own admission, cop fireman,gov. pension recipient, you know little about what motivates entrepreneurs. We started a business in tough times knowing that if we were lucky and smart enough to be successful we would be taxed a little more and it never once came into the discussion on whether or not to start this business.. Entrepreneurs look for opportunity and could care less about tax rates. Learn a little history. Motive is all about need and the ability to fill it. I have been a self employed entrepreneur my entire life and the politics of taxes never made a significant influence on my decisions. Lazy wanna be's think they know what moves people but you are so wrong. I was in business during Reagan then Clinton and the tax policies never entered the equation. Job creators could care less about marginal tax rates, total myth. Been there unlike most of you arm chair "job creators".

Interesting...Life long bureaucrat by my own admission? NO!!! In both the PD and FD I was in the trenches risking my life every day. As an Officer in the FDNY, there was administrative work, but I was still in the field risking my life every day. Bureaucratic? HARDLY. My pension is from NY State, and the combined worth of the five major Public Safety/Service systems, is over 100 Billion dollars. IT is administered by Bureaucrats, and competently so, unlike California and Colorado. I paid a large percentage of my pay towards my pension. So stop trying to make it look like I'm an over the hill pencil pusher on the public dole, because it just isn't so. You call me a lazy wannabe? What do I wannabe - you ? NO !!! Am I an arm chair "job creator" NO !!! I also was a successful business owner in a real tough place to make a living - NYC, while in the FDNY. Siding and windows, and a car service. I did p.d. well. I seriously doubt if you ever could perform at the standards to which I was held, then or now. I have cousins that are currently business owners, and your line of thought is so far out in left field, you are on the outside of the fence. They are very concerned about everything from the tax issues to the true cost of MessiahMed. I don't know where you own your business, but it doesn't seem like it's on this planet. What I read in you snitty little unprovoked little diatribe against me is a healthy dose of jealousy, coupled with not a whole lot of sensibility, with a hearty dose of plain old ignorance. You ought to know what is dribbling out of that hole under your nose before it starts to dribble out. P.S. Lazy ? NO !!! I have done and continue to do various volunteer gigs. Money isn't everything, and besides, I have enough for what ever it is I want to do ( probably unlike yourself).

My post was not directed at you personally,you protest a little too much, I was trying to make more general point that a small increase in the marginal tax rate does not effect "job creators". My remarks were directed more toward career politicians that bleat that tired old line when they have spent their entire careers on Gov. payrolls. I respect most government workers especially police and fireman, but repeating the "tax job creators" fallacy shows a complete lack of knowledge in understanding business or how the economy really works. Again a little economic history would be helpful to this crowd, No need to be rude.

I think the definition of bureacrat needs to include whether a job is a necessity or fluff. Necessary government and quasi-government jobs are things like police, firefighters, road care, military and so on. Fluff is easy to define, does the person wear a suit and accomplish almost nothing? Fluff.

HEARTLESS wrote: I think the definition of bureacrat needs to include whether a job is a necessity or fluff. Necessary government and quasi-government jobs are things like police, firefighters, road care, military and so on. Fluff is easy to define, does the person wear a suit and accomplish almost nothing? Fluff.

Like career politicians that know nothing?

Exactly.

JMC wrote:

Spykster wrote:

JMC wrote:

Spykster wrote: Regardless of the above spins...the DemonCrats, et al, will have their chance to do whatever with this issue after the elections...They won't be fired the next day...their days will be numbered, but they as well as the other morons will have some time left. But, it really doesn't do them any good campaigning wise to have let this happen in view of the Viking's post above...^ Speaking of shooting themselves in the feet, I'm surprised they're not all rolling around on dollies by now...

As a life long bureaucrat, your own admission, cop fireman,gov. pension recipient, you know little about what motivates entrepreneurs. We started a business in tough times knowing that if we were lucky and smart enough to be successful we would be taxed a little more and it never once came into the discussion on whether or not to start this business.. Entrepreneurs look for opportunity and could care less about tax rates. Learn a little history. Motive is all about need and the ability to fill it. I have been a self employed entrepreneur my entire life and the politics of taxes never made a significant influence on my decisions. Lazy wanna be's think they know what moves people but you are so wrong. I was in business during Reagan then Clinton and the tax policies never entered the equation. Job creators could care less about marginal tax rates, total myth. Been there unlike most of you arm chair "job creators".

Interesting...Life long bureaucrat by my own admission? NO!!! In both the PD and FD I was in the trenches risking my life every day. As an Officer in the FDNY, there was administrative work, but I was still in the field risking my life every day. Bureaucratic? HARDLY. My pension is from NY State, and the combined worth of the five major Public Safety/Service systems, is over 100 Billion dollars. IT is administered by Bureaucrats, and competently so, unlike California and Colorado. I paid a large percentage of my pay towards my pension. So stop trying to make it look like I'm an over the hill pencil pusher on the public dole, because it just isn't so. You call me a lazy wannabe? What do I wannabe - you ? NO !!! Am I an arm chair "job creator" NO !!! I also was a successful business owner in a real tough place to make a living - NYC, while in the FDNY. Siding and windows, and a car service. I did p.d. well. I seriously doubt if you ever could perform at the standards to which I was held, then or now. I have cousins that are currently business owners, and your line of thought is so far out in left field, you are on the outside of the fence. They are very concerned about everything from the tax issues to the true cost of MessiahMed. I don't know where you own your business, but it doesn't seem like it's on this planet. What I read in you snitty little unprovoked little diatribe against me is a healthy dose of jealousy, coupled with not a whole lot of sensibility, with a hearty dose of plain old ignorance. You ought to know what is dribbling out of that hole under your nose before it starts to dribble out. P.S. Lazy ? NO !!! I have done and continue to do various volunteer gigs. Money isn't everything, and besides, I have enough for what ever it is I want to do ( probably unlike yourself).

My post was not directed at you personally,you protest a little too much, I was trying to make more general point that a small increase in the marginal tax rate does not effect "job creators". My remarks were directed more toward career politicians that bleat that tired old line when they have spent their entire careers on Gov. payrolls. I respect most government workers especially police and fireman, but repeating the "tax job creators" fallacy shows a complete lack of knowledge in understanding business or how the economy really works. Again a little economic history would be helpful to this crowd, No need to be rude.

Actually, if you go back and read your post, it was directed right between my eyes..."bureaucrat....by my own admission...gov't pension"... "lazy wannabes think they know what moves people but you are so wrong"...etc. My post that you responded to was a slap to the face primarily at DemonCrats who didn't have the guts to tackle a tough issue - rather - they are trying to save their hides while keeping a hurting and scared American public hostage to their personal and political whims, and also the Republicans as well. I referenced a post just before yours...from Viking. Always remember...I do not shy away form anything. If I had my way, I'd still be crawling around in burning buildings with my gear on fire... :VeryScared: Anyway...Friends ??? :hands: