Was John Quincy Adams A "Founding Father"??

Only in the drafting of the documents? What of the debates for ratifying or rejecting them? How about the members of the first federal government formed under them that gave substance to the documents and set policies for the very first actions of that government? Would you not classify the first members of the House of Representatives and Senate who proposed, debated and submitted for approval the first 12 proposed amendments as founding fathers solely on the basis that they were not part of the committee that drafted the original document that was submitted to the states for their consideration? What of John Jay? You will not find his signature on either the Declaration of Independence nor the Constitution and yet no one would think to believe he was not one of the founding fathers.

No 2wlady - JQA is excluded here because some wish to engage in intrigue in order to demagogue another with whom they disagree. Nothing more, nothing less. A more liberal view of founding fathers is not to be allowed if a more narrow definition permits excuse for the demagogic behavior.

Something the Dog Said wrote: All of which is your personal opinion, not supported by any facts.

Quite the contrary Dog - all it contains are reasoned conclusions derived from the facts.

FDR and Congress did not threaten the Supreme Court with their majority? Of course they did.

The Supreme Court's rulings didn't change immediately in the wake of that threat being issued? Of course they did.

The "Switch in Time That Saved Nine" is also a matter of fact.

That the 1942 ruling of the court allowed for the expansion of federal power to invade where it had previously been forbidden by a previous court and was reached by a majority of FDR appointees is also a matter of fact.

That the funding mechanism for the AAA and the SSA are nearly indistinguishable and one was ruled unconstitutional prior to the threat and the other in the wake of it is also simply a matter of fact.

The truth has no agenda Dog - it simply exists. All of what I have stated here is truth. Unvarnished and unspun.

PrintSmith wrote: [ Unvarnished and unspun.

I don't buy it, PS.

If Obama instead of Bachman had tried to claim John Quincy as a "founding father" you'd have been passionate in your riducule of the idea.

I'm sorry, but your partisanship is obviously clouding your viewpoint on this one.

The Viking wrote: Was just waiting for a left winger to post this. I will bet if you took a poll of all Americans that at least 50% would think he was a founding father. In fact in our highly under educated society, I will bet it is closer to 80%. But what is so funny about all of this is the liberal media. They jump on little gaffes that Republicans make that most Americans wouldn't have even known were wrong. But when it comes to Obama, they let the stupidest comments slide, and HE is running this country! So tired of the libs jumping on people for minor misstatements but ignoring our President who is a total embarassment.

Just a few......

He visited 57 states

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AspenValley, you really need to review this post. You would also be saying that this "dis" about Bachman by the liberals is way out of line.

Our Constitution was written '20 centuries' ago! We have been here 2000 years?

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He laughs at the fact that he took $1 trillion and didn't have shovel ready jobs like he said.

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He thinks Europe is a country?

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Did he have a stroke here?

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He thinks is Austrian is a language?

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He can't pronounce corpsman.... calls them corpse-men

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He compares America today to the Nazi's.

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He makes fun of the Bible

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Here is a lot of them in one video.

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Claims he is a Muslim

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Lied about his uncle serving in Aushwitz

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Has to use a teleprompter to talk to 6th graders

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Making fun of the Special Olymics

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Farts on live TV....

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Love this compilation..... and this is just one interview!

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major bean wrote:

The Viking wrote: Was just waiting for a left winger to post this. I will bet if you took a poll of all Americans that at least 50% would think he was a founding father. In fact in our highly under educated society, I will bet it is closer to 80%. But what is so funny about all of this is the liberal media. They jump on little gaffes that Republicans make that most Americans wouldn't have even known were wrong. But when it comes to Obama, they let the stupidest comments slide, and HE is running this country! So tired of the libs jumping on people for minor misstatements but ignoring our President who is a total embarassment.

Just a few......

He visited 57 states

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AspenValley, you really need to review this post. You would also be saying that this "dis" about Bachman by the liberals is way out of line.

At least you admit she made a gaffe, unlike some of the other right-wingers on this site who are instead trying to spin her whopper as "the truth".

Frankly, I think too much is made of obvious misstatements by politicans on both sides of the aisle. The fact that Bachman messed up regarding John Quincy Adams or Sarah Palin mangled her account of Paul Revere's ride doesn't bother me as much the attempts by them or their supporters to make their messed up versions somehow "true". And yep, Obama misspeaks, as did Bush, as did Clinton, as did Bush Sr., as did probably George Washington. I think everybody makes too big a deal out of trivial mistakes instead of focusing on more important issues.

If Obama has visited 57 states then he's more patriotic than those who have visited only 50, right?

I refudiate that...

I'm guessing Bachman got John Adams, the second president, mixed up with John Quincy Adams, the sixth. It's amazing how people backstep on this and other issues in order to change history to what someone said by mistake.

WayneH wrote: I'm guessing Bachman got John Adams, the second president, mixed up with John Quincy Adams, the sixth. It's amazing how people backstep on this and other issues in order to change history to what someone said by mistake.

I think this is a function of the 24/7 newscycle and every little thing said by a candidate or official being instantly parsed, dissected, disseminated, ridiculed and repeated on 50,000 blogs and forums.

In and of themselves, a few mangled phrases don't mean much if it's clear the speaker just made a superficial error. No one knows everything, and no one always speaks perfectly without fumbling or just plain messing up.

I get a little more worried, however, if the speaker habitually indulges in nonsensical "word salad" or worse, tries to spin their blooper as "fact".

She was asked about it later and said she meant what she said and that she knew he was 9 years old at the time.

It was all a convoluted explanation to explain her comment that the founding fathers fought tirelessly to end slavery.