Bergdahl - The Hypocrisy and Hate Must End

04 Jun 2014 00:31 #21 by otisptoadwater

LadyJazzer wrote: A day without a call for impeachment is a day without sunshine... :biggrin:



Indeed, we finally agree on something!

I can explain it to you but I can't understand it for you.

"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the Government take care of him; better take a closer look at the American Indian." - Henry Ford

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges; When the Republic is at its most corrupt the laws are most numerous. - Publius Cornelius Tacitus

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04 Jun 2014 07:52 #22 by homeagain
Having spent most of the morning educating myself on this prisoner release, listening to
the talking heads, listening to those soldiers who were THERE WHEN IT HAPPENED, listening to
what they perceived of this man...I can only come up with this...YES, he did,in fact, leave
his post without permission,BUT, here's what I think is the reason...JMO...I believe he experienced a moment of self-discovery and SHOULD have claimed status as "conscientious
objector", but instead he walked away from the conflict....it is documented that particular
unit had moral problems, leadership issues (lack of) and that this man was conflicted about his
"service".....I think his MORAL COMPASS dictated his actions (wrongly so)....I am NOT a military
expert, so I do NOT know the procedure for declaring "C.O." AFTER THE FACT....it will be
very interesting to see IF this theory is correct..... :SadLeave:

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04 Jun 2014 07:59 #23 by FredHayek
Good point, if he was truly against the war, he could have declared "CO" status, instead of deserting his post and abandoning his team.

From the White House this morning: Bergdahl is being Swiftboated!
Or maybe the truth is different from Rice saying the Sgt. had a distinguished record?

Thomas Sowell: There are no solutions, just trade-offs.

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04 Jun 2014 10:11 #24 by ScienceChic
Was Bergdahl a Deserter? This Is What Happens When a Soldier Disappears
And more facts on who deserts, why, and what happens to them.
—By Tasneem Raja
| Wed Jun. 4, 2014

While pundits and vets argue over whether Bowe Bergdahl, the Army sergeant released from five years of captivity in Afghanistan by the Taliban in exchange for five Guantanamo Bay prisoners, is a hero or a traitor, one thing is clear: like Bergdahl, tens of thousands of soldiers have walked away from duty in the past two decades alone, and the Army has been puzzling over what to do with deserters for far longer. Here's a primer:

What's the difference between a deserter and someone who's AWOL?
The terms "deserter" and "AWOL" are often used interchangeably, but in fact one condition precedes the other.

AWOL: Any soldier who has taken unauthorized leave from their training or duty station
Deserter: On 31st day of AWOL, a soldier is "dropped from the rolls" and administratively marked as a deserter

A good analogy between the two is the difference between cutting a class and dropping out of school altogether. It's important to note that being administratively classified a deserter doesn't necessarily mean a soldier has been convicted of desertion, which is a felony offense and involves a whole different process, usually involving an arrest and a court-martial.

So where does Bergdahl fall? He was captured within 24 hours of leaving his base without authorization. As the military news site Stars and Stripes makes clear, he was never classified as a deserter.

What happens to deserters?

Read more at the link if you wish, they've got additional stats and info.

I haven't done all of the research on his case. I know his fellow troops have said he left, yet many hundreds others have as well (having a bad day, emotional breakdowns, combat stress overload, etc - a snap bad decision that they take back later, or maybe don't), but they had the chance to come back before repercussions because they didn't get captured. I'd rather wait and find out what's learned during his debriefing, and what actions the military takes - rehab, discharge, court-martial, etc - before I condemn this man based on incomplete information. The fact of the matter is, as Jim Wright said, he's an American and our first duty is to bring everyone home that we send into the grind of war - we're even still searching for POWs in Korea. Then he can be dealt with for proper justice if need be, but we don't leave him to the enemy.

Those screaming that what Obama did was wrong to bring him home, and that he needs to be impeached, need to step back and realize we've done this countless times before, negotiating and working with terrorists. Our hands are not clean and will never be so long as we continue to interfere in foreign affairs, so long as power corrupts the human soul, and the ends justifies the means.

"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

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04 Jun 2014 10:41 #25 by Blazer Bob

ScienceChic wrote: [
Those screaming that what Obama did was wrong to bring him home, and that he needs to be impeached, need to step back and realize we've done this countless times before, negotiating and working with terrorists. Our hands are not clean and will never be so long as we continue to interfere in foreign affairs, so long as power corrupts the human soul, and the ends justifies the means.


Who is screaming that? I have hear that he did not give proper notice to congress and I have heard the deal could have been better negotiated but I have not heard an outcry that he was wrong to bring him home.

I believe some individuals have said that but that is not the stance of the right . Saying so is just a hate filled strawman like calling the whole Tea Party racist.

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04 Jun 2014 11:00 #26 by FredHayek
Mother Jones? Weren't they encouraging American soldiers to desert during the Vietnam War? The type of lefties that would have manned the AA gun with Jane Fonda in Hanoi.

ScienceChic wrote: Was Bergdahl a Deserter? This Is What Happens When a Soldier Disappears
And more facts on who deserts, why, and what happens to them.
—By Tasneem Raja
| Wed Jun. 4, 2014

While pundits and vets argue over whether Bowe Bergdahl, the Army sergeant released from five years of captivity in Afghanistan by the Taliban in exchange for five Guantanamo Bay prisoners, is a hero or a traitor, one thing is clear: like Bergdahl, tens of thousands of soldiers have walked away from duty in the past two decades alone, and the Army has been puzzling over what to do with deserters for far longer. Here's a primer:

What's the difference between a deserter and someone who's AWOL?
The terms "deserter" and "AWOL" are often used interchangeably, but in fact one condition precedes the other.

AWOL: Any soldier who has taken unauthorized leave from their training or duty station
Deserter: On 31st day of AWOL, a soldier is "dropped from the rolls" and administratively marked as a deserter

A good analogy between the two is the difference between cutting a class and dropping out of school altogether. It's important to note that being administratively classified a deserter doesn't necessarily mean a soldier has been convicted of desertion, which is a felony offense and involves a whole different process, usually involving an arrest and a court-martial.

So where does Bergdahl fall? He was captured within 24 hours of leaving his base without authorization. As the military news site Stars and Stripes makes clear, he was never classified as a deserter.

What happens to deserters?

Read more at the link if you wish, they've got additional stats and info.

I haven't done all of the research on his case. I know his fellow troops have said he left, yet many hundreds others have as well (having a bad day, emotional breakdowns, combat stress overload, etc - a snap bad decision that they take back later, or maybe don't), but they had the chance to come back before repercussions because they didn't get captured. I'd rather wait and find out what's learned during his debriefing, and what actions the military takes - rehab, discharge, court-martial, etc - before I condemn this man based on incomplete information. The fact of the matter is, as Jim Wright said, he's an American and our first duty is to bring everyone home that we send into the grind of war - we're even still searching for POWs in Korea. Then he can be dealt with for proper justice if need be, but we don't leave him to the enemy.

Those screaming that what Obama did was wrong to bring him home, and that he needs to be impeached, need to step back and realize we've done this countless times before, negotiating and working with terrorists. Our hands are not clean and will never be so long as we continue to interfere in foreign affairs, so long as power corrupts the human soul, and the ends justifies the means.


Thomas Sowell: There are no solutions, just trade-offs.

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04 Jun 2014 14:12 #27 by LadyJazzer
Yeah, here's how the GoTeaBaggerParty outrage machine is dealing with it:

GOP Strategists Are Arranging Media Interviews To Attack Bowe Bergdahl

..[T]he report about the only known American prisoner of war in Afghanistan, who was released in a prisoner swap secured by the Obama administration this weekend, also revealed a larger story about the backlash against Bergdahl by disclosing that Republican strategists organized media interviews with members of his former platoon.

On Tuesday, BuzzFeed identified Richard Grenell, who once served as an aide to U.S. ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton and later worked for Mitt Romney’s 2012 presidential campaign, as playing a key role in publicizing Bergdahl's critics.

"My role was to ask the firm to help facilitate the interviews for free. Brad Chase agreed to do it. He is handling all the requests. He isn't political. I originally spoke to Cody, the leader, via Twitter then asked the firm," Grenell told The Huffington Post's Sam Stein.


Just another day in the Rightie Outrage-of-the-Day SwiftBoating Echo-Chamber....

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04 Jun 2014 14:24 #28 by FredHayek
Who is going to know his reasoning better than the guys he lived with for months?
Maybe we should also interview his Taliban captors to find why he made the decisions to abandon his post?

Thomas Sowell: There are no solutions, just trade-offs.

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04 Jun 2014 14:29 #29 by LadyJazzer
Maybe we should wait and have the JAG staff interview HIM? What a concept?!?! Wait for the FACTS.

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04 Jun 2014 15:15 #30 by FredHayek
JAG? They should be objective,(not!) they want to be promoted so they would never make a decision based on politics. Weren't they the same people who decided a man yelling "Allah Akbar" as he shot up Fort Hood was workplace violence instead of terrorism?

Any people here with military experience? Would you trust Bergdahl's squadmates over the JAG?

Thomas Sowell: There are no solutions, just trade-offs.

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