ABORTION ON DEMAND - A NEW TWIST

ramage wrote: To answer your questions:
1. For the insurance company it is a business decision, nothing more.
2. For the same reason a fetus does not pay income tax.
3. The census has evolved from excluding Indians and counting slaves as 3/5 of a person. Perhaps
it is time to count a fetus. I would not discount democrats from pushing for this if they feel that
the benefits to their party.
Now as to my fixation as to when life begins, without a grounding in a moral belief your questions, answered above, reflect your situational morality, to which I do not subscribe.

But just think about how much the life insurance companies can make off insuring a fetus. Astronomical premiums, so it's probably not a business decision. But no, they don't insure the unborn because they know it's not a human.

Children do not pay income tax, therefore... what? What is your argument?

Your census argument is weird. Something about 3/5 yada yada yada. Does not even begin to make sense. If a fetus truly is a human life, then the census should count a fetus. But it doesn't, so... I guess it's not considered a human life.

Situational morality. Interesting twist. You would force a woman to carry an unplanned pregnancy, whether a mistake in contraception or a rape, to term, essentially making her a unwilling vessel to your morality. You have read Handmaid's Tale, right?

Interestingly, the Jewish religion did not consider a fetus a human life. It had to be born.

What about the fertilized eggs for in vitro? Are those humans? According to you, they are.

One of the benefits of a transcontinental flight is the ability to interact via the internet without interruption.
Were to start? So many misconceptions.
Let's begin with some history. The U.S. Constitution is not yada, yada, yada, (very erudite). Your school should have taught American History rather than TV comedies. A compromised was reached in the Constitutional Congress and put in the U.S. Constitution (Article 1, Section 2, Clause 3) that counted a slave as a 3/5 person for purposes of the census.
Next we shall discuss the insurance business.Yes, the premiums would be astronomical and as such the insurance would not be purchased. Again you post in sweeping generalizations, ", they don't insure the unborn because they know it's not a human.", is that because you have no factual knowledge and therefore cannot present a compelling argument?
The fact that a fetus does not pay income tax is on the same farcical plane as why they do not have SSN's.
Every Jew that I know and have known has never considered the infant in the womb, an "it", as you commonly refer to aa fetus. The fact that the Talmud in strict reading, says that life does not begin until the infant has been out of the womb for 30 days, is a view that I would like to think that you do not subscribe to. I can say with confidence that no Jewish physician has adopted such a literal interpretation.
I would not force anyone to do anything. I am not in a position to make that decision nor will I vote for any law that does not protect an unborn child. In that you refuse to opine as to when life begins, we can have no discussion.
No I have not read the Handmaiden's Tale.

Let me be clear once more, in my opinion live begins with conception, I define that to be the implantation of a viable zygote in the uterus. Without implantation it is impossible to know how many zygotes have been created.
What is your opinion?

It's precious how you condescendingly attempt to insult me.

First, the whole 3/5 thing - I understand it was about the Constitution and the way slaves were treated but your original argument, a couple posts up, makes absolutely no sense. Thus the yada yada yada.

Children often have SS numbers, many just a month or so after they are born. Why not fetuses? If, as you say, they are human life at conception, then the government should acknowledge that they are citizens and issue a number.
Or are you afraid this is more of a Miracle on 34th Street situation where the government delivered mail, addressed to Santa, to a man on trial, therefore he is Santa since he is acknowledged by the government?

That's why I wrote "Jewish religion did not consider..." rather than "do not."

You should read Handmaid's Tale, even a condensed version will do. You'd probably laugh and enjoy it.

You want to force women that have conceived, either through failed contraception or rape, to carry the fetus to term. If I remember correctly, you want to outlaw abortion in all cases. That's forcing a woman to not have control over her body.

My opinion is that a fetus becomes a human when it has brain activity and can survive outside the womb, roughly around the end of the second trimester, as I've previously posted.

You do realize rape is a very tiny percentage of abortions. In most cases, abortion is only used as birth control.

And in the rape cases, the perp isn't killed, an innocent victim is instead.

What is a tiny percentage? Give me a number.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8765248/

The national rape-related pregnancy rate is 5.0% per rape among victims of reproductive age (aged 12 to 45); among adult women an estimated 32,101 pregnancies result from rape each year. Among 34 cases of rape-related pregnancy, the majority occurred among adolescents and resulted from assault by a known, often related perpetrator. Only 11.7% of these victims received immediate medical attention after the assault, and 47.1% received no medical attention related to the rape. A total 32.4% of these victims did not discover they were pregnant until they had already entered the second trimester; 32.2% opted to keep the infant whereas 50% underwent abortion and 5.9% placed the infant for adoption; an additional 11.8% had spontaneous abortion.

Wow. That's a lot of rapes and a lot of pregnancies.


Oh, and there is this more recent study. Maybe you read about it? It was all over the lame stream media for a couple days.

www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/25/ab...after-rape-laws-bans

Nearly 65,000 rape-related pregnancies likely occurred in the 14 US states with near-total abortion bans following the US supreme court’s 2022 Dobbs decision – yet just 10 legal abortions are performed monthly on average in these states, researchers found in a new analysis.

The data demonstrates that abortion bans likely make it impossible for most victims of rape to obtain abortions in their home states, even for the minority of people who live in states with exemptions for rape, researchers said.

Put yourself in a woman's place for once. How would you feel if the government forced you to carry a rapists baby to term?

Put yourself in a woman's place for once. How would you feel if the government forced you to carry a rapists baby to term? (Per K)

THAT RIGHT THERE.....no ability to view the "life changing" event that will NEVER be forgotten....it's called empathy and the male species does not have to endure the physical,mental,emotion baggage that is heaped upon the psyche. R U aware of how many rape kits (completed) r in storage and have NEVER been opened.

DO the research....it is a sham and women r being cast aside as not a priority...DNA THAT WOULD PROVE
THE ATTACK, R NOT BEING RUN THRU COTIS (spg?)) The perp remains at large, has the freedom to
repeat and repeat again. Netflix just ran a doc series on this EXACT ISSUE....the woman was not believed, her boyfriend collaborated the story and yet, it took YEARS and another police officer (a woman)to connect the dotted lines and found a serial rapists . He was apprehended and charged,but it was an unbelievable cluster fuck of lack of follow thru and concern.

If a woman or child is raped, they have zero responsibility for a pregnancy and should be treated differently than a woman who made a conscience decision to have sex.

What I find frustrating is the lack of strong penalties for men who commit the rapes.

“We hear a lot of talk from Democrats about protecting women, but it seems they want to protect criminals more than women in California,” said DeMaio.

“I guess we shouldn’t be surprised because in the past 10 years California Democrats have repeatedly voted to approve bills that favor criminals - from backing early release from prison (Prop 57) to eliminating prosecution of many serious crimes (Prop 47),” he continued.

Because existing California law does not classify rape and domestic violence as “violent felonies,” convicted criminals can be released early due to lighter sentencing requirements outlined in Prop 57.

Think of how many Democrat policies start in California, and then tell me why this isn't a problem.

Yes, I diverted slightly from the topic, but if we are going to talk about rape and abortion, I think this is an import aspect that the pro-abortion crowd skips over. Personally, I think rapists should spend life in prison and hopefully they are raped daily.
reformcalifornia.org/news/democrats-refu...erson-a-felony-in-ca

Wow. Whodathunkit?

www.cnn.com/2024/02/21/us/alabama-ruling...auses-ivf/index.html

Days after Alabama’s Supreme Court ruling that frozen embryos are children, a second clinic pauses IVF treatment

A second fertility clinic in Alabama has halted part of its IVF treatment programs following the state Supreme Court ruling that frozen embryos are children.

Alabama Fertility’s clinic in Birmingham has “paused transfers of embryos for at least a day or two,” according to Penny Monella, the chief operating officer at Alabama Fertility Specialists.

This marks the second known fertility clinic to at least temporarily stop treatments. On Wednesday, The University of Alabama at Birmingham health system became the first organization in the state to confirm that it is pausing IVF treatment out of legal concerns in wake of the court’s ruling.

The ultimate definition of BAT SHIT CRAZY.....and just when u think the worst of the worst has been waged upon women...SURPRISE, THE SOUTH sends out another signal....U (women) R SECOND CLASS CITIZENS and we will ensure that .....after all, we enslaved people of color,even tho the law forbid that practice....(I've been to the south to live,BIG MISTAKE) The past century is where they inhibit and wish to remain.