thoughts on the Trayvon murder

It's interesting to listen to the audio files of the 911 calls. They are posted at that motherjones link. Just scroll down a bit to see them.

http://motherjones.com/politics/2012/03/what-happened-trayvon-martin-explained

archer wrote:

The Liberals GOP Twin wrote:

archer wrote: Unless, of course, the immediate investigation was botched and the evidence was never collected that might assist in getting at the truth. The whole thing just seems "off" to me.....

Well... you'll never believe any of the evidence no matter where it comes from, the local police, the Feds... you already have an agenda for this case to fit into and nothing will change your hoped for scenario.

You are wrong, of course, I really don't have a set opinion on this case....not enough info yet. I'm glad the Feds are looking into it, personally I would hate to think this guy shot Martin just because he could, I also would hate to have a deliberate shooting covered up, neither is a "hoped for" scenario........will you believe the feds if they decide that this was murder or manslaughter?....I will certainly follow the grand jury and the feds to find out if they have evidence that this was clearly self defense, if that's the case then at least it will have been fully investigated. It may turn out to be a very sad turn of events that could have been avoided if Zimmerman had stayed in his vehicle till the police showed up......locked the doors if necessary, driven away if he felt threatened by Martin.....all would have resulted in a better outcome and none of us would be reading about it now. Should they prosecute Zimmerman if he was just stupid? Like I posted before.....there just seems to be something "off" about the whole incident.

Good answer. We agree for once. Yes... I still trust our system enough to figure that this will shake out with the facts. But there are a few things bothering me. This happened on Feb. 28th, 2012... almost a month ago. We are just hearing about it this past week, and it's already become a political football even though there is little official information from the authorities. Yet it has already been turned into a racial issue, a “wanted dead or alive” advertisement issued for Zimmerman by the New Black Panthers, Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton chiming in with the usual rhetoric and it's being turned into a general dividing issue before any hard evidence or information has been made public.

Maybe I'm just not racially sensitive enough, or maybe I'm missing something, but my first impression is that this incident is being used as a political issue even before it's warranted. I'm very willing to accept the facts... when we actually have them all.

plaidvillain wrote: I titled the thread as I did because I believe the evidence indicates this was an act of murder, and while I accept this to be merely my opinion, I find it amazing anyone would think the situation doesn't at least warrant a more thorough investigation. If the kid had shot Zimmerman, he certainly would have been required to defend his innocence.

Again, the whole point is that there isn't going to be a jury, the facts won't come out, justice and truth won't be realized, because charges haven't been pressed, the police weren't interested....it was easier, or more convenient, or preferred to just let it go. UNLESS people speak out and demand justice...insist upon it. Keeping quiet and waiting for the truth to be volunteered to you is foolish.

There is a difference between belief and knowledge. Fact is, you haven't heard or seen any evidence yet that indicates anything at all, what you have heard is hearsay. Fact of the matter is that the police, who saw Zimmerman and his injuries in the immediate aftermath of the event that night, had reason to believe that his narrative of the events corresponded to what they were seeing, which is why they didn't arrest him. Fact of the matter is that what you believe to be the case might very well be tainted and colored by your desire to see any confrontation between two individuals of dissimilar races as a racial incident. Fact of the matter is that a more thorough investigation has been in the works since the night of the incident. Homicide detectives were called to the scene, the gun used that night is still in the hands of the police in case it is needed as evidence in a trial and the investigation wasn't closed prior to the liberal press, and liberals in general, seeking to turn this into a racially motivated incident and an opportunity to push an anti-gun agenda. The fact of the matter is that a dispassionate review of the investigation thus far fails to support what you believe - which is why Zimmerman remains free and hasn't been charged with a crime at this point. Fact of the matter is that Zimmerman himself is a minority, though I did note that CNN is referring to him as a white Hispanic (have they ever referred to Obama as a white Black?) who has worked extensively with underprivileged black children, continuing to mentor two of them at his own expense after government funding was lost for the program in which he was participating - not the portrait of your typical racist, is it. Makes one wonder why that background material was so tardy making its way into the reports seeking to portray the incident as racial in origin, doesn't it?

Some of Zimmerman own words on the 911 calls are keeping the issue of racism in the forefront of this investigation. They're hard to ignore. They don't necessarily make him guilty of murder or manslaughter but they do create cause for a thorough investigation.

What words are those archer? Are we speaking of when he said something to the effect that the ***holes always get away, or his alleged use of a racial slur that a CNN audio engineer wouldn't be willing to say was uttered if called as a witness in a court of law because, even with his expertise and enhancement, what was said was not clear enough to his ears for him to be certain. Or are we talking about the response he gave when queried by the 911 operator regarding the race of the person he was observing?

PS...all of your "fact of the matter is" statements aren't fact...they're your opinion....just like all of our posts are. I was simply pointing out why this has become such a media circus....there are good reasons why some see racism in his words and actions. They are just as entitled to their opinion as you are to yours...

Which ones are not fact archer? Let's discuss the ones you feel are mere opinion instead of established fact.

PrintSmith wrote: There is a difference between belief and knowledge. Fact is, you haven't heard or seen any evidence yet that indicates anything at all, what you have heard is hearsay. Fact of the matter is that the police, who saw Zimmerman and his injuries in the immediate aftermath of the event that night, had reason to believe that his narrative of the events corresponded to what they were seeing, which is why they didn't arrest him.

Really? It couldn't be because their on the site investigation was sloppy? or they just wrote it off as this kid must have been a bad kid so Zimmerman did the right thing? Your fact of the matter is your opinion.

Fact of the matter is that what you believe to be the case might very well be tainted and colored by your desire to see any confrontation between two individuals of dissimilar races as a racial incident. Fact of the matter is that a more thorough investigation has been in the works since the night of the incident. Homicide detectives were called to the scene, the gun used that night is still in the hands of the police in case it is needed as evidence in a trial and the investigation wasn't closed prior to the liberal press, and liberals in general, seeking to turn this into a racially motivated incident and an opportunity to push an anti-gun agenda.

I think it is more likely that this is the result of a community seeking to turn this into a racial issue because they actually believe it is......how do you know they are all liberals? As for gun control, every time there is a gun crime you start squealing that the liberals are going to push gun control. That, again, is your opinion.

The fact of the matter is that a dispassionate review of the investigation thus far fails to support what you believe - which is why Zimmerman remains free and hasn't been charged with a crime at this point. Fact of the matter is that Zimmerman himself is a minority, though I did note that CNN is referring to him as a white Hispanic (have they ever referred to Obama as a white Black?) who has worked extensively with underprivileged black children, continuing to mentor two of them at his own expense after government funding was lost for the program in which he was participating - not the portrait of your typical racist, is it. Makes one wonder why that background material was so tardy making its way into the reports seeking to portray the incident as racial in origin, doesn't it?

Dispassionate review? really? that's a fact? Nope, I think that is your opinion PS, we don't know yet how accurate the review has been, nor do we know much else about the real "facts" in this case.

IMHO - our community has no diversity ----so most posts here have thin credibility

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no offense just a fact.

Maybe this community, deltamrey, but many of us grew up in communities that were diverse or have lived adult lives in those types of communities. I, for one, grew up on military bases just after the military was desegregated. I also was at a base just outside Wash. D.C. and as a child went into DC with my parents, so I saw plenty of racism.