Vote no on 4A

Thanks for the links to Friends of Elk Creek and Elk Creek Fire and the information provided.

You, the taxpayer, are being conned. But you really should vote yes for the increase because you have a whole lot of pensions and benefits coming up in future years that haven't been shown in the projected 10 years that is going to wipe out every increase you give them. So might as well get used to it now.

And if pensions are so nominal as one person mentioned above then do away with them altogether and you will have enough money in the future w/o having to continually ask the taxpayers for pay increases.

Has anyone asked Elk Creek Fire to show you that information since they have the contracts they have made with every f.f.?

I also haven't had a chance to check ECF application and contract showing benefits provided during their 10 years and then the amounts after 10 years. Anyone have this information? I certainly don't see any of it at Friends of Elk Creek or Elk Creek Fire.

In regard to the question on the ballot http://elkcreekfire.org/ECFD/Welcome_fi ... estion.pdf

People have to be nuts to give the f.d. an open ticket to not only buy the specified two fire tankers and one fire engine “and for the ongoing operation and maintenance of fire protection services”. You are giving them a free ticket to do anything they want. That means conferences in other states, dental plans, ANYTHING they chose so long as they can justify the ongoing operation and maintenance of fire protection services. You are potentially committing yourself to lavish buildings, like Evergreen, bigger pensions and benefits and others items with this sloppy open ended language. And they will come back and tell you that they have a group or someone who is very responsible and will only do what is necessary. Yep they can tell you anything but you just gave them a blank check.

And if that isn’t enough, the last clause “all without limiting in any year the amount of other revenues that may be collected, retained and spent by the district”. That means you are telling them it is ok to come ask for another increase at any time during the duration. Are you nuts?

Who just gives an entity a blank check when they haven’t been responsible in the past with their budgets, benefits and pensions.

Private fire departments have proven to be a better solution if you are looking for an alternative than these money sucking districts. I came back to add that I am not advocating private fire departments. I am advocating having a question that is specific and does not give a blank check as it is currently written.

Vote NO. The question is outrageously slanted and sloppily written to solely benefit the f.d. It does not provide the specifics needed to stop ECFD from continuing to waste your taxpayer money.

Big Dougy wrote: Huh? it was 8-6 with the No's winning and within an hour it was 16-8 with the Yes's winning. It looks like the entire Elk Creek Fire department logged on to vote for themselves. This is no longer an acurate poll. Anyway, I voted YES because as a union man I always want to get more money and benefits to the people, I just don't want my money going towards the making of anymore of those gay calenders..I'm ok with a new flat screen or chili pot for the firehouse, but no more calenders please

#enoughalready

Those "Gay" Calendars have nothing to do with Elk Creek Fire Funds. Elk Creek does not pay .01 cent for anything related to those calendars. Those are produced by a private organization http://cofirefightercalendar.org and proceeds go to the children's burn center. Not my definition of "Gay" and certainly not relevant in this debate.

Keep in mind that while property values have dropped, they are now on the rise. Assessments are slow to follow true property values, but they will follow, naturally increasing the FD coffers.

A FEW jurisdictions now have a www site that posts ALL expenditures (FULL transparency, open books....posted to the taxpayers) ...software, internet access and a part time FTE clerk.....taxpayers FIRST should do this (say 2013-2014) THEN (say 2015) look at needs of the department (EC FIRE AS AN EXAMPLE) independently from management. BET they would be very surprised. EVERY NICKLE.......as in ALL expenditures......and yearly INDEPENDENT audits.......commercial firm....not another group of clerks.

I will proudly vote YES on 4A. I like paying taxes for things that benefit the common good.

#ImInLoveWithBIgDougyEvenThoughHeMightBeGayRepressed

I think we all know that those that Vote NO either.. A.) Don't have any future chances of needing the fire dept. for any of their services and/or B.) DO have the future chances of needing their services but will Vote NO and still call them for help if they need it or for seeing smoke from a nearby campfire. Reminds me of people that b*tch about hydraulic fracturing. Every single person I've ever heard or seen b*tching about hydraulic fracturing and how it needs to stop and oil and gas companies are devil incarnate, etc etc etc...then turn around, go home where their house is heated by it, they take showers by it and they cook their meals with it. If you don't want to help your local mostly VOLUNTEER fire dept for yer stupid @$$ self centered reasons then you'll kindly go out and take a wee on the next forest fire in that district and see how that works out for you.....yea, thought so.

I try and stay the hellout of the Courthouse, I really try, but when I see idiot locals complaining about services that have saved their @$$es, it fries me to the core. To the point of visceral anger.

Actually, there's a correction needed. True LOCALS know better. Those that aren't are the ones lint pickin', however, even transplants should know that a good fire dept with reliable equipment is essentially important to their existence.

Jekyll wrote: I think we all know that those that Vote NO either.. A.) Don't have any future chances of needing the fire dept. for any of their services and/or B.) DO have the future chances of needing their services but will Vote NO and still call them for help if they need it or for seeing smoke from a nearby campfire. Reminds me of people that b*tch about hydraulic fracturing. Every single person I've ever heard or seen b*tching about hydraulic fracturing and how it needs to stop and oil and gas companies are devil incarnate, etc etc etc...then turn around, go home where their house is heated by it, they take showers by it and they cook their meals with it. If you don't want to help your local mostly VOLUNTEER fire dept for yer stupid @$$ self centered reasons then you'll kindly go out and take a wee on the next forest fire in that district and see how that works out for you.....yea, thought so.

I try and stay the hellout of the Courthouse, I really try, but when I see idiot locals complaining about services that have saved their @$$es, it fries me to the core. To the point of visceral anger.

Disappointed in your comments Jekyll. It is not because I am a$$ self centered. I care about my community. I have been around for quite some time. Native born. We cannot continue to bear the brunt of extravagant fire engines, buildings, pensions to volunteers for life after 10 years of very part time participation, etc. If it will make you feel better I won't contact the fire department. In the old days we took care of it ourselves. Look at the wildfire in eastern Colorado this last summer. Many ranchers/farmers got their farm tractors and took hold of it so that the prairie fire wouldn't go wild without waiting for the fire department. If you look at many on the eastern plains and rural areas, they don't have all the whistles and bells that Elk Creek Fire is asking for and do just fine. I hope the residents say again, enough is enough and Vote NO.

Grady wrote: Keep in mind that while property values have dropped, they are now on the rise. Assessments are slow to follow true property values, but they will follow, naturally increasing the FD coffers.

Its difficult for me to trust any prediction involving real-estate, especially if safety of life issues are involved. The Great Recession was caused by complex real-estate speculation. It was not predicted by any of the experts. Now the same folks predict that real-estate will recover and not cause another recession ...