Vote no on 4A

SC. I suspect there are perfectly reasonable explanations for those pictures. I just want someone in the KNOW to explain them.
I did see several of those pics on the ELK Creek FB page and the context was a little clearer.
I am closer to your point of view on this.
I am uncomfortable with some of the information that KS has not brought forward.
I question the website, especially now that a link to it has been posted and KS has said nothing of his involvement with that website. Not that he/she is not allowed to create such a website but would not take ownership when it was brought forward. That just seems a little under handed to me.

LOL wrote:

LadyJazzer wrote: Well, I was going to vote 'No'...But after watching all of the usual anti-tax zealots complaining about "oversight" and "misuse of funds", and screeching about $100/month pensions (after 10-years of service) as "wanting more money for their own benefits".... I'm convinced...

I'm voting 'Yes".....

LadyJazzer wrote: Oh darn... I got my ballot on Saturday and already marked it 'YES" on 4A... I guess that means that if enough of us do that, all of the anti-tax zealots will end up paying a few more dollars...

My bad....

Sure sounds like a logical, non-emotional thought process to me. Those SOBs "anti-tax zealots" complaining as usual about oversight and misuse of funds, Geez Who cares about that?. LOL Carry on!

P.S. I don't live in this district and I do support volunteer firefighters, I actually was one for many years. I also support rational thinking and budget analysis over spontaneous knee-jerk emotions.

And I'm fed up with underhanded, scorched-earth dirty tricks, innuendo and character assassination crap from the usual teabaggers....

Like I said, before all of the sleazy crap, I was going to vote 'NO'... Thanks to the usual tactics by the usual Randroids, I'm voting 'Yes'...

All of the pictures are from Elk Creeks Facebook page. The website even tells you that.

I don't blame KS. You people would eat your own to put a face to a name. Seems like a simple offering of information that already exists to me. Kind of a one stop shop for the other side.

Who cares who registered a site. All that means is they own the domain.

Can you imagine how this person would be treated by you in public if you knew who they were. If you have friends who are democrats and you are republican, would you be as nasty and vial as you are about this. Why in gods name cant you respect someone for standing up for what THEY believe in. (the way you are demanding they respect you) Why does it have to be your way or " I hate you!"?

You say they should fill your shoes... How do you know they don't. Are the only shoes fire boots?
What about fellow community members, Rotarians, chamber members, parents and so on. There is a crap ton more to this community than Elk Creek Fire. Will you still be a hater in 10-15 days when this is all done? What if you win. Will you be the people that says " I told you so!" Or the bigger person that either way, puts it rest.

A sad demonstration by people that tout themselves leaders and hero's.

:faint: :faint:

frogger wrote: truthatecfd.com/waste/

Though I place no stock in this website at the moment.....I would like someone to explain some of this to the public.

If you go to http://truthatecfd.com/waste/ or http://truthatecfd.com/ the pages are now blank. There is no content on those pages.

Twister- "You say they should fill your shoes... How do you know they don't. Are the only shoes fire boots?What about fellow community members, Rotarians, chamber members, parents and so on. There is a crap ton more to this community than Elk Creek Fire."

Yes, I said until you fill these boots stop asking the volunteers to do more. So, in this case these are the only boots that matter, you don't see the firefighters asking the chamber, rotary etc to volunteer more time, do more stuff etc. I did not say that being a volunteer firefighter is the only way to help, obviously there are tons of way to help your community but the issue in the forum is around ECFD. So, yes until you fill these specific boots, please stop saying that the volunteers need to spend more time, cover more shifts etc., we do a ton already.

As to try to answer questions regarding the pictures that were up on the "vote no" guys website, they are no longer there so I am going from memory.

1-the snow making equipment, i was not a participate in this but I do know that it was used as a water and pumps training, and a pre-run to see of we would be able to help a community event. I believe most if not all of the equipment was old stuff in the back of the bay, came from volunteers and was all welded by a couple of the volunteers, was a small amount of piping bought, i have no idea but if it was and like science chic said its not on the budget the membership most likely picked up that bill.

2-Tubing in gear. The rookie class had class that day and was brought to the event to support the community and help with prepping the course. They were not told before hand that they would be attending the event and did not have snow geear with them, they were not going to the event with the intent to tube. No gear was damaged during that event. On a side note the gear they were wearing is no where near being worth $2000-3000. It is all very outdated and NFPA would probably not approve of how old some of it is, but it is all that we had. Yes to replace gear would be expensive. Tubing in gear in much less harmful to it then the wear and tear placed on it during trainings and especially at real fires.

3-the "horsing around" pictures, first off none of these were on a fire ground or any type of call, they were taken at station 1 (as can be seen in the background of at least 1) and yes, we have fun AFTER we train hard, its called brotherhood.

4-The ECFD does not have brotherhood. That is nothing but crap, it is an awesome place to be and amazing, supportive people that have a great time and have each others backs. Fro what I have heard it was not always this way but in the 2 years i have been on ECFD this is the case.

5-No safety line on a rope decent picture. We follow all safety guidelines that any other rope rescue team uses, without the picture in fromt on me I cant give specifics except I am sure we had all teh needed safety things in place.

6-No helmet, no safety line window bailout picture. Yes, the guy standing on the ladder whould have had a helmet on. This picture was from 3 years ago, this last academy we made changes to this training to include a safety line and we strive to always be in the correct PPE. On a side note, at a community meeting someone stood up and was angry that the dept buys helmets for the graduating members, to that person-if we don't buy helmets for the new members we cannot have them to wear for safety.

7-Pictures on physical training involving tires-No, we probably won't ever have to lift a tire onto a dumpster at a call, but yes we are required to lift lots of heavy things and need strength and endurance as well as teamwork. The exercise pictured work on all three of these things and we have tires and dumpster sitting around so it is free!! We train hard so we are ready for a hard call. As for this stuff will cause injuries, yes unfortunatly firefighting is dangerous and injuries might occur, we do everything we can to prevent them. But a small injury in training is much better then a large injury that puts the whole team at jepordy on the fire ground at a ral call.

I'm sure there are more pictures but without them in front of me this is from memory.

Thank you for the explanations. I just went to that site, and there are pictures there now. I don't know if any have been changed/removed or not.

Twister wrote:

All of the pictures are from Elk Creeks Facebook page. The website even tells you that.

I don't blame KS. You people would eat your own to put a face to a name. Seems like a simple offering of information that already exists to me. Kind of a one stop shop for the other side.

Who cares who registered a site. All that means is they own the domain.

Can you imagine how this person would be treated by you in public if you knew who they were. If you have friends who are democrats and you are republican, would you be as nasty and vial as you are about this. Why in gods name cant you respect someone for standing up for what THEY believe in. (the way you are demanding they respect you) Why does it have to be your way or " I hate you!"?

You say they should fill your shoes... How do you know they don't. Are the only shoes fire boots?
What about fellow community members, Rotarians, chamber members, parents and so on. There is a crap ton more to this community than Elk Creek Fire. Will you still be a hater in 10-15 days when this is all done? What if you win. Will you be the people that says " I told you so!" Or the bigger person that either way, puts it rest.

A sad demonstration by people that tout themselves leaders and hero's.

:faint: :faint:

Do you read entire posts or just the highlights you agree with?

I qualified that he had every right to put up a page in support of his position. It is his reluctance to be totally honest that bothers me.
What I said in regards to the facebook page is that the photos appear in a series which tells a little more complete story.
The pictures on the website are a bit like taking quotes out of context and altering there meaning.

Thanks Kassk20.
An explanation is most always all that is needed. Thanks for taking the time to provide one.

Walter L Newton wrote:

frogger wrote: truthatecfd.com/waste/

Though I place no stock in this website at the moment.....I would like someone to explain some of this to the public.

If you go to http://truthatecfd.com/waste/ or http://truthatecfd.com/ the pages are now blank. There is no content on those pages.

Sorry,

My Ad Blocker was preventing any content from those pages to appear in my browser. The content is there, my mistake.

jf1acai wrote: Thank you for the explanations. I just went to that site, and there are pictures there now. I don't know if any have been changed/removed or not.

See my correction up thread. My Ad Blocker was preventing me from seeing any content on that site. It was a mistake on my end.