“The 37-page indictment contains no evidence of collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign, but it does show a systematic effort to discredit the result of the 2016 election. On the evidence so far, President Trump has been the biggest victim of that effort, and he ought to be furious at Vladimir Putin.
Readers of the indictment will be amused at the comic opera details. In or around June 2016, for example, Russians posing online as Americans “communicated with a real U.S. person affiliated with a Texas-based grassroots organization.” This “real U.S. person” vouchsafed the deep political secret that the Russians “should focus their activities on ‘purple states like Colorado, Virginia & Florida.’” Sure enough, the Russians thereafter referred to targeting “purple states.” Someone actually paid Russians to collect this insight.
The indictment also makes us wonder what the Obama Administration was doing amid all of this. Where were top Obama spooks James Clapper and John Brennan? Their outrage became public only after their candidate lost the election. If they didn’t know what was going on, why not? And if they did, why didn’t they let Americans in on the secret? President Obama sanctioned Russia for its meddling only after the election.”
As in my earlier post: look no further than Boris and Natasha.
The WSJ editorial is behind a firewall. I can post it in its entirety if requested and if it does not violate forum rules.
For clarification, no, per Fair Use Guidelines you cannot copy and paste the entire article here as that is a violation of copyright law. What you can, and should, do is copy the link to the original article so people can go straight to it and choose for themselves if they wish to pay to access the article or not (links to the original source should be posted for everything any of us cite from, actually). Is this the article to which you are referring ramage?
www.wsj.com/articles/the-russian-indictments-1518825574
I found this link also, which appears to be a copy of the article (unknown if this was copied with permission, it may disappear if they get a take-down notice from WSJ):
www.paywallnews.com/news/The-Russian-Indictments.rk2UvVSvz.html
In answering your post, that is a damn good question and one which some of the accounts I've shared here, @counterchekist and @20committee in particular, have denounced the Obama administration for being way too weak on their response to Russia's interference. They knew what was going on and they didn't crack down harder.
"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill
So, over the last year, I've become a member of the crew on the Trump Train. I'm the bartender, come on down for a double sometime, but seriously, some peeps need to know their limit!
What I find abhorrent to the fullest degree is the hypocrisy of some of my fellow voters when it comes to "treading water" ie; constantly making excuses for reprehensible governing from our POTUS's, all the way back to Bush Sr. It's incredibly childish. This go around, my Dad, who's seventy years old now, basically excuses everything bad Trump does because it's simple revenge for hatred against Obama. Not even kidding here, and it's so damned immature I can't even talk politics with him any more. I'll give Trump credit for a lot, just ask me, but I'll call crap when it's colored and smelly like crap. Conservatives, liberals, independents, etc all claim to be middle of the road when life fits their state of mind. When it doesn't, the baby's out the window with the bath water.
Personally, I'm sick and tired of hearing about Russia, marital affairs and Mara Lago. There are so many whale sized fish to fry with our crumbling country. The fu***** guy got elected, he's been there for awhile, either toe the line or get out. No more whining. At the same time, so called Conservatives, don't excuse some of his absolutely disgusting and fireable behavior when if it were a Dem doing it you'd be howling from the highest mountain and wanting an assassination!
Well said! Exactly how I feel! Enough with this "impeach Trump" business and Russian collusion. It's a dead horse. Both parties need to start working in reality, and get on with the business of this country.
ramage wrote: SC,
Yes the reference regarding the WSJ editorial is correct. Are you able to access it without being a subscriber to WSJ?
Yes, that link I posted shows the article I found by doing a Google search of some of the text you posted, and I am not a WSJ subscriber. As I mentioned with Fair Use Guidelines, if that website copied the article in its entirety without permission and the WSJ discovers it, they can (and likely will) issue a Take-Down Notice which means it could disappear.
Thank you for joining us spurlde, it's nice to have another voice in the conversation! I am curious as to why you think this subject is a dead horse though? To date, there have been 17 indictments filed and 4 guilty pleas (Flynn, Papadopolous, Gates, and Pinedo) in exchange for lessened punishments. I've posted links to the indictments (at least I think I have all of them, if I'm missing some, please let me know), have you read through them? What are your thoughts on those?
The latest news is that Rick Gates, Trump's Deputy Campaign manager and partner with Manafort, is changing his not guilty plea to guilty in exchange for a deal.
Adam Khan @Khanoisseur 19 Feb 2018
Adam Khan Retweeted Malcolm Nance
Gates was Trump's Deputy Campaign manager, and was indicted along with Manafort on money laundering + illegal foreign lobbying. Gates knows better than anyone whether there was a deeper Russian or foreign influence campaign via Manafort, targeting Trump, GOP or anyone else.
Malcolm Nance @MalcolmNance
With Gates turned state evidence Manafort will plead soon. He will give up Trump, Kushner & Trump jr for a deal. Mueller’s Money laundering end game could come as fast in 60-90 days. Does not mean impeachment but will open up Trump’s tax returns.
www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-rick-...-20180218-story.html
Special counsel Robert Mueller has reported a new criminal accusation against President Trump's former campaign chairman Paul Manafort.
Mueller's team said in a court filing Friday that it learned of "additional criminal conduct" claims against Manafort, including "a series of bank frauds and bank fraud conspiracies" relating to a mortgage on Manafort's property in Fairfax, Va.
The new criminal accusation came in response to a request from Manafort to reconsider the conditions of his bail.
"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill
The Democrats never considered "W" as a real president because he lost the popular vote but won the electoral college. And the Dems will never consider Trump legal even after hedominated Hillary Clinton in the electoral college too. And proved their polls wrong. Maybe the Left are just poor losers? Time to move on and be happy Trump will be replaced in 2020?
Thomas Sowell: There are no solutions, just trade-offs.
SC,
Pray tell what does this have to do with "collusion with the infamous Russians". Maybe we can invite Mr Mueller's team to Denver to investigate the murder of William Anderson in the Denver City Jail. They might find that OSHA regulations were violated by Ricardo Lopez Vera (sarcasm).
Mueller adds bank fraud to Manafort’s list of alleged criminal conduct
BY JOSH DELK - 02/17/18
Special counsel Robert Mueller has reported a new criminal accusation against President Trump's former campaign chairman Paul Manafort.
Mueller's team said in a court filing Friday that it learned of "additional criminal conduct" claims against Manafort, including "a series of bank frauds and bank fraud conspiracies" relating to a mortgage on Manafort's property in Fairfax, Va.
The new criminal accusation came in response to a request from Manafort to reconsider the conditions of his bail.
Two things:
1. Trump filed the trademark "Make America Great Again" in 2012, and there was chatter (in Russia, see opinion piece at bottom) that he was going to run as early as 2013.
2. Manafort and Gates were directly involved in his campaign finances and they have ties to Ukraine and Russia; they operated as foreign agents for years without registering as such. They know where his donations came from.
Zoe Tillman Verified account @ZoeTillman 7:10 AM - 20 Feb 2018
Alt_SeanSpicer'sMic @Alt_Spicerlies 1 hr ago to 18min ago
Who is PERSON A?
Dear MSM & pundits Please do NOT conflate an Indictment v Information They are VERY different.
indictment = trial
Information means the defendant has reached: a plea deal waives trial and appeal admits to guilt typically they then become cooperating witnesses
Also MSM you are missing something important look at the header & assignment date
Pure speculation so take this with a grain of salt. Person A is Manafort Also look at the DATEs, August & Sept of 2016 1) Manafort was still serving as @realDonaldTrump campaign chair until Mid Aug 2016 2) Gates was STILL on Trump’s campaign
(i) “surreptitiously recorded calls”.
It was WIDELY reported that Manafort was wiretapped
I do NOT think Law Firm A is Skadden Arps my guess is it’s: Manafort’s original firm or someone in Trump’s orbit. Also Trump never cut off communiques w Manafort after he resigned
also some will say this Plea is in NO way related to Trump. Simply put they are WRONG. German Khan (FIL of Alex Van der Zwaan) is one of 3 suing over the dossier
Your receipt
www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2...man-aven-khan-243461
ht to @roxydavis99 me lurves her hard
Yep. If they're going after Khan, Letterone and Alpha, that means Mueller already has Alpha's Trump Tower sh*t. That's the whole enchilada. America mark this day, you're delivery is near. John , @LouiseMensch and @counterchekist told this day would come.
God Bless America
In truth, this is just the first wave of Mueller’s indictments against Team Trump. More, and worse, is headed to 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. The special counsel’s efforts to rope White House staffers into obstruction charges now take on different coloration as what they were trying to hide is coming into focus. At a minimum, events like the Team Trump June 9, 2016 meeting in Trump Tower with the Russian attorney Natalya Veselnitskaya—in reality, a Russian intelligence officer—ostensibly to discuss adoptions, look more sinister when viewed against the backdrop of the broader Kremlin conspiracy against our election. As do pro-Kremlin changes to the Republican platform on Ukraine that were pushed by Team Trump at the party’s mid-July 2016 convention in Cleveland.
Then there’s highly classified intelligence demonstrating that Donald Trump was planning on running for the presidency—with Kremlin backing—years before the 2016 election. Back in the spring of 2014, a European intelligence service, a NATO ally of the United States, received a top-secret report that the Russians would back Donald Trump for the White House in the next election. The source was a mid-level Russian intelligence official who had plausible access to secret Kremlin plans.
Moreover, this source had a track record of providing accurate information, so his Trump bombshell merited examination. However, our partners determined that the notion was so absurd—after all, Trump was a reality TV star, a mere carnival barker, not a serious person—that the report had to be Russian disinformation. The source was put “on ice” for several months and his information was not shared with the Americans, since our friends didn’t want to appear so foolish as to suggest Donald Trump would run for president with secret Russian help.
"Now, more than ever, the illusions of division threaten our very existence. We all know the truth: more connects us than separates us. But in times of crisis the wise build bridges, while the foolish build barriers. We must find a way to look after one another as if we were one single tribe.” -King T'Challa, Black Panther
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill
Is Trump now colluding with the Ukranians as well as the Russians?
"2. Manafort and Gates were directly involved in his campaign finances and they have ties to Ukraine and Russia....."
ramage wrote: Is Trump now colluding with the Ukranians as well as the Russians?
"2. Manafort and Gates were directly involved in his campaign finances and they have ties to Ukraine and Russia....."
Been away for a few weeks but wanted to jump in here.....
Manafort and Gates were involved in the political discourse when Russia very heavily engaged in aggression towards Ukraine. In fact, Manafort goes way back with Russia and Putin.
The indicator of quid pro quo is the change in the Republican Platform easing the R's stance on providing arms to the Ukrainian forces who were standing up to Putins aggression.
