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Impeachment proceedings against Trump

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ScienceChic replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 03 Dec 2017 17:31 #81

You can attack the messenger, but the message remains the same. Do you think the indictments and guilty pleas are all lies?


The hope of a secure and livable world lies with disciplined nonconformists who are dedicated to justice, peace and brotherhood. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

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FredHayek replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 03 Dec 2017 22:57 #82

If you dig deep enough, especially with many inexperienced new hires, you will find crimes being committed. But I think it is prudent to see what other crimes and connections develop before you loudly declare President Trump will be impeached. I have seen this in the past where underlings willingly fall on their swords to save their boss.


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Rick replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 04 Dec 2017 11:07 #83

ScienceChic wrote: You can attack the messenger, but the message remains the same. Do you think the indictments and guilty pleas are all lies?

By "messengers" , do you mean the obviously biased media that spends every minute of every day trying to take down Trump? The message they are giving the sheep is completely biased because they are all butthurt from Trump's victory and Trump's negative remarks about their bias and bullshit. I don't know if the guilty pleas will have anything significant to do with Trump and the year long claim of Russian collusion. Now that they can't find collusion, the media is shifting to obstruction. But if there was no collusion, what's the motivation for obstruction?

It also bothers me, and it should bother all Americans, that a pro-Hillary/anti-Trump FBI agent was one of the lead investigators in the email investigation and also of the Trump collusion investigation. Now I see why there was no grand jury appointed and why Comey drafted her exoneration statement long before the investigation was over, I guarantee this FBI agent was probably one of many who wanted to shield Hillary and to take out Trump which really makes the FBI look like just another propaganda wing of the Democrat party, just behind the worthless media.

As a scientist I would think that you would be one who looks for facts first before jumping to an "impeachment hearings" thread as if you know the facts, when in fact it's been over a year and there isn't any evidence that would warrant impeachment, just media hopes and dreams at this point.

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chrisd3711 replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 04 Dec 2017 12:58 #84

I have been following this thread, and, of course, the news in general, with great interest. One bottom line is that Donald Trump is a groper (or worse) of women, could care less if millions of predominantly lower-income folks lose their healthcare benefits, knows nothing of public service, has questionable ethics, is a compulsive liar, is absolutely self-centered and is not otherwise worthy or qualified to be President of the United States. Another bottom line is that he IS President of the United States.

I continue to place my faith in the institutions and Constitution of the United States of America. We are one of (if not the longest-lasting) governments in the world still in existence to the present day. We have endured poor Presidents and have gloried in great ones. I can only pray that my faith, which is solidly rooted in hope, will win the day!

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ScienceChic replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 04 Dec 2017 16:50 #85

Well said chrisd3711, and welcome to MMT! Appreciate you jumping into the conversation. :)

Others may have "loudly declared" FH, I just reported the fact that Articles of Impeachment have been filed twice now. Nothing has been done with them, they've been ignored, but the fact remains that they have been filed and they can be acted upon at anytime.

Continuing on with the facts, attached is the Flynn Plea Deal Agreement in its entirety. You can also find it at this link.

File Attachment:

File Name: flynn_plea...2-04.pdf
File Size:742 KB


Rick, why do you think they're trying to ruin Comey's credibility, and sow anger and disbelief at news organizations? Why do you think they keep bringing up Hillary's emails? I see liberals being told to "get over it, she lost" and yet it seems to be the other side bringing her up over and over (but her emails!). Deflection is not a decent defense of wrong-doing, and that's what those who are the target of this investigation are doing. There was a very damning Tweet sent by @realdonaldtrump this weekend about firing Flynn that his lawyers then back-pedaled saying they actually wrote it and posted it, then they laughably tried to claim that Trump can't be held accountable for obstruction because presidents are above the law. I recall Nixon tried to use that same defense, didn't work out so well for him either.

I am a former scientist, and the truth and facts matter very much to me. I haven't made any claims that there will absolutely be impeachment hearings, but it sure does seem that things are headed that way. I've followed multiple sources, weighed what I read, been cautious in believing people until they've proven their credibility, and watched as those in charge flout the law, use their own private emails and phones, denigrate citizens, try to strip rights from citizens, and I worry for the future of our nation. I'm not about bring Trump down because I dislike him, I'm about saving our country and its values, its promise of equal opportunity for all, and justice to all. Special Mueller's investigation was started specifically because of possible obstruction of justice - it was Comey's firing after refusing to give Trump a "pledge of loyalty" or refusing to drop the investigation into Russia's possible interference in our election that prompted his firing, not an investigation into Trump's campaign conspiring with Russia. Just because it's been a year doesn't mean a thing, it was more than a year and a half for the whole ordeal with Nixon and this case is a lot more complicated with more players on an international field. And there has been progress made, it's not "hopes and dreams," they've been reporting on what's come to light as it has. That's their job.


The hope of a secure and livable world lies with disciplined nonconformists who are dedicated to justice, peace and brotherhood. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

Your scars exist, but it’s your courage that defines you. ~Nalini Singh
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ramage replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 04 Dec 2017 17:33 #86

STRZOK, need more be said?

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ScienceChic replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 06 Dec 2017 09:36 #87

Strzok was fired from the Special Investigation by Mueller months ago after text messages came to light that showed him as being partisan. As detailed below, this shows Mueller's investigation as being more credible, less partisan, and more on the up-and-up. If it was simply a "witch hunt", he would've kept him on the team.

The new right-wing attack on the Mueller probe, explained
Conservatives see the FBI agent dismissed from Mueller’s Russia investigation as proof of a witch hunt.
Updated by Zeeshan Aleem @ZeeshanAleem This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Dec 5, 2017

“The fact that Robert Mueller fired an investigator immediately when these texts came to light is evidence he’s running a tight ship and lends credibility to his investigation — not detracts from it,” Lisa Gilbert, an expert on government ethics at the watchdog group Public Citizen, told me.

And when it comes to the Clinton memo, Strzok wasn’t acting alone. According to CNN, the memo drafting process was a “team effort” and a “handful of people” reviewed the edited language.

Furthermore, there is no reason to think that Strzok could’ve overridden Comey’s own view of Clinton’s conduct. Even if Strzok were in fact leading a partisan effort to tweak the language out of a personal desire to defend Clinton, he couldn’t have done it against the will of his own boss. And Comey is famously hostile to political favoritism or chumminess with politicians.

“That fact that it appears Mueller removed Strzok from the investigation as soon as he find out about the messages tends to underscore Mueller’s seriousness about keeping the investigation free from even the appearance of bias,” Noble told me.


The hope of a secure and livable world lies with disciplined nonconformists who are dedicated to justice, peace and brotherhood. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

Your scars exist, but it’s your courage that defines you. ~Nalini Singh

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driver8 replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 06 Dec 2017 10:17 #88

And let us not forget that the leaks from pro-trump, anti-clinton agents during the election last year....

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/nov/03/...s-comey-donald-trump

Did they get removed?

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ramage replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 06 Dec 2017 14:40 #89

I can only presume that Mr. Mueller did not vet his team. Strzok and Weissmann, both had shown their partisanship well before Mueller hired them. But again it wasn't in the NYT or WashPost. It should be noted that when asked by Congress the reason for Strzok's "demotion, firing, re-assignment, etc, (chose your own term) the committee was stonewalled. Perhaps he was fired because his extra-marital affair would look poorly in light of the day.

Gotta love this paragraph:

"Furthermore, there is no reason to think that Strzok could’ve overridden Comey’s own view of Clinton’s conduct. Even if Strzok were in fact leading a partisan effort to tweak the language out of a personal desire to defend Clinton, he couldn’t have done it against the will of his own boss. And Comey is famously hostile to political favoritism or chumminess with politicians."
Comey LEAKED FBI documents so that they would be published and lead to an Independent Investigator.
He lied to Congress.

If Zeeshan Aleem is correct then we should see Mr. Weissmann be fired.

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ScienceChic replied the topic: Impeachment proceedings against Trump 14 Dec 2017 22:41 #90

Oh dear.
Special Counsel requested this in the fall, but now we're hearing about it which means something is coming in regards to this.

Mueller Sought Emails of Trump Campaign Data Firm
Special counsel asked Cambridge Analytica to hand over employees’ emails, in sign of investigators’ interest in campaign data operation
By Rebecca Ballhaus
Dec. 14, 2017 7:15 p.m. ET

Special Counsel Robert Mueller has requested that Cambridge Analytica, a data firm that worked for President Donald Trump’s campaign, turn over documents as part of its investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 U.S. election, according to people familiar with the matter.

Mr. Mueller asked the firm in the fall to turn over the emails of any Cambridge Analytica employees who worked on the Trump campaign, in a sign that the special counsel is probing the Trump campaign’s data operation.

The special counsel's request, which the firm complied with, wasn’t previously known. The emails had earlier been turned over to the House Intelligence Committee, the people said, adding that both requests were voluntary.

During the campaign, Cambridge Analytica provided data, polling and research services to the campaign.

This is a video interview of one of Trump's campaign marketing managers explaining how they advertised using the Cambridge Analytica data. With Facebook's direct help.
The digital guru who helped Donald Trump to the presidency
BBC News
13 Aug 2017

A key insider from the Trump campaign's digital operation - Theresa Wong - unravels for the first time the role played by social media and Facebook's in getting Trump into the White House.

Jamie Bartlett learns how Facebook's vast power to persuade was first built for advertisers, combining data about our internet use and psychological insights into how we think.

How Cambridge Analytica gathered its data in the first place and how it's used against you.
The Data That Turned the World Upside Down
Psychologist Michal Kosinski developed a method to analyze people in minute detail based on their Facebook activity. Did a similar tool help propel Donald Trump to victory? Two reporters from Zurich-based Das Magazin went data-gathering.
Hannes Grassegger & Mikael Krogerus
Jan 28 2017, 8:15am

On November 9 at around 8.30 AM., Michal Kosinski woke up in the Hotel Sunnehus in Zurich. The 34-year-old researcher had come to give a lecture at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology (ETH) about the dangers of Big Data and the digital revolution. Kosinski gives regular lectures on this topic all over the world. He is a leading expert in psychometrics, a data-driven sub-branch of psychology. When he turned on the TV that morning, he saw that the bombshell had exploded: contrary to forecasts by all leading statisticians, Donald J. Trump had been elected president of the United States.

For a long time, Kosinski watched the Trump victory celebrations and the results coming in from each state. He had a hunch that the outcome of the election might have something to do with his research. Finally, he took a deep breath and turned off the TV.

On the same day, a then little-known British company based in London sent out a press release: "We are thrilled that our revolutionary approach to data-driven communication has played such an integral part in President-elect Trump's extraordinary win," Alexander James Ashburner Nix was quoted as saying. Nix is British, 41 years old, and CEO of Cambridge Analytica. He is always immaculately turned out in tailor-made suits and designer glasses, with his wavy blonde hair combed back from his forehead. His company wasn't just integral to Trump's online campaign, but to the UK's Brexit campaign as well.

Of these three players—reflective Kosinski, carefully groomed Nix and grinning Trump—one of them enabled the digital revolution, one of them executed it and one of them benefited from it.

A timeline.
A timeline of everything we know about how Russia used Facebook, Google, and Twitter to help Trump win
By Kerry Flynn
Sep 08, 2017

Editor's note: This piece has been updated numerous times and will continue to be updated as new revelations emerge.

Facebook played a vital role in the outcome of the 2016 election—ask any digital director on one of the presidential campaigns, or maybe some Russian propagandists.

News that Facebook took at least $100,000 from Russian troll farms to promote socially and politically divisive content reignited discussion around just how much of an impact Facebook had in getting Donald Trump elected.

It also begged a serious question: Had Facebook helped Russia manipulate the outcome?

How social media marketing has influenced our politics, and how easy it is for outside influences to sway the outcome of our elections.
What's really important about Facebook Russia Ads
Those Russian-bought online spots might be just a hint of a darker, undetected flood of attempts at influence, according to experts in political communication.
Peter Grier Staff writer | @petergrier
September 19, 2017

Yes, a shadowy Russian firm with ties to the Kremlin bought about $100,000 worth of Facebook ads intended to sway voters during last year’s presidential campaign, the social media giant disclosed earlier this month.

Does it matter? Given the tens of millions spent on political ads in 2016 that’s a bucket of water thrown down a storm drain. And influencing elections with ads is a delicate science. It requires coordination, timing, and finesse – three things the Russian ad buy doesn’t seem to have had.

The problem is, those Russian-bought online spots might be just a hint of a darker, undetected flood of attempts at influence, according to experts in political communication. To use a different analogy they might be the equivalent of the Watergate break-in. That was a petty crime that by itself didn’t sway the 1972 election. Its real importance was rooted in the vast, illegal conspiracy of which it was a symbol and product.

This genie cannot be put back in the bottle. Moving forward, we must guard against future manipulations. Facebook, Twitter, and other social media platforms need to be more tightly regulated since they aren't doing it themselves. No foreign money should be buying political ads - Facebook has taken some steps to address this, but I don't think it's enough. I didn't even post additional articles on the fake groups that were created by Russian operatives and accumulated hundreds of thousands of members - that's a black hole of influence because they don't have to purchase ads to reach millions with their propaganda. Nor have I shared the sh*tstorm that is Twitter with its infestation of millions of bots and fake accounts, and how those networks have been shown to actively work to make propaganda go viral. It's a huge problem that cannot be ignored.


The hope of a secure and livable world lies with disciplined nonconformists who are dedicated to justice, peace and brotherhood. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it. ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is. ~Winston Churchill

Your scars exist, but it’s your courage that defines you. ~Nalini Singh

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